Commuter Rail System - for us?

I do not know much about the Hyderabad system

Here you go...

MMTS was built on an equal expenditure basis by Government of Andhra Pradesh and the South Central Railway and is operated by the latter.

GoK should put their money where their mouth is. CRS will not happen by leaving it to IR. I have mentioned this before, have a state authority which will buy the rolling stock and invest in signalling and let IR just control traffic.

Possible options to pursue CRS

• SWR alone, GoK or MoUD subsidise some capital expenditure for them (track doubling, first set of rakes/EMUs).
• A Joint Venture betweek GoK, SWR, like MMTS of Hyderabad to operate the service. This JV will have to pay to use SWR's assets.
• A PPP (put this idea to Mr Ashok Kheny, or Capt Gopinath - such a thing may do more good to Bangalore than them running for elections) that will buy or lease SWR's assets, build new assets, and run Commuter Rail on them.

None of the above except #1, or even #1, is going to happen because I am sure BMRCL is going to object - this new thing will be seen as competition by them.

In that case, how about:

• Extend BMRCL's jurisdiction to SWR's assets in the city, and have them run Commuter Rails with cooperation from SWR.

We can talk a lot of options. And I bet the informed people from government or South Western Railway side would be laughing reading all this - look at the these crazy guys, they talk anything without knowing the details and complications.

But sorry, we don't care for these organizational and structural details. Anyone who reminds us of details is only telling us that he doesn't have the will or drive to take initiatives.

We know of a problem - transportation in the city, and see a solution because other cities have it - Commuter Rail. Period. Rest is all details, the "how" that I don't care about.

A PPP (put this idea to Mr Ashok Kheny, or Capt Gopinath - such a thing may do more good to Bangalore than them running for elections)

Gpoinath may be interested in Cargo and IR has already opened up Cargo train services for PPP. It sees money there. It has not done the same for commuter as like Naveen said there could be losses involved. This is where the GoK has to step in.

they talk anything without knowing the details and complications.

If MMTS can drive a CRS with the same IR, Mumbai and Chennai can drive local train services with the same IR. I do not see what horns Bengaluru has got to not have CRS. Capacity issues can be worked out when experts sit at the table. It will need investment in signalling to reduce block sizes and maybe some extra switches. Extremely doable and can easily complement metro along ORR between ECT, WHF, KRP, BYP & YPR

We had an earlier thread for Kengeri-Whitefield shuttle train here : http://praja.in/bangalore/discuss/2008/07/kengeri-whitefield-shuttle-train.

Bottleneck I see is the SBC-Whitefield link which is highly utilized with trains running every 10 minutes in that route. I was just thinking if one shuttle train between Kengeri-SBC or Bidadi-SBC started to run every hour and observe the occupancy level. Commuters can hop off to intercity trains like Chennai Mail or Marikuppam passenger and getdown at Whitefield / Byappanahalli / KR Puram.

If the occupancy level increases, an additional track can be laid from SBC till Whitefield. This needs additional lands, but may not be expensive.

If it fails, Bidadi/Kengeri train can be extended to Channapatna. Many daily travellers  to Bangalore will be helped a lot. All the trains are crowded from Channapatna.

WIthout doubt there has to be a proper evaluation done on utilization of current tracks. Additional tracks may be required, Additional stations will need to be put in. Are there any technical studies or recommendations on CRS for bangalore? The only links I get lead back to Praja!!! Are we the only people talking about it?

The drawing below shows all rail lines. To carry forward the CRS idea, I think you are right, SB - we must take it to the next level. Can we get more ideas of how useful services could be started within the available network ?

I was just going through this article on the IRFCA:

http://www.irfca.org/articles/surface-mass-transit.html

about how cheap is commuter rail system compared to Metro and Mono.

Author talks about two things,

1. Develop alternate routes for freight traffic.

2. Ease terminal constraints.

SBC-Byappanahalli has the most traffic and it reduces after Byappanahalli, since few trains divert towards Yelahanka and few towards KR Puram - Whitefield. Our focus area is reducing railway traffic on SBC-Byappanahalli to incorporate commuter-rail system or local trains.

Answer to the freight traffic:

One thing that the SBC-Byappanahalli traffic will contain is the freight traffic. This is because Goods Shed is in SBC.  Develop another Goods shed at the outskirts like done in Mysore at the tip?

Other thing is the goods coming from Mysore travelling towards Byappanahalli. As per this article, develop alternative routes for freight means we should have a circular link at the entry points Yelahanka, Whitefield Yeshwantpur connecting to Kengeri.  (Just thinking theoretically).

Answer to the passenger traffic:

For the passenger trains, I was just thinking of satellite train stations like Yeshwantpur at Whitefield and Yelahanka. Except very main and important long running trains, many of the passenger trains can be cutoff at these points. Passengers can hop off the long distance train and hop on to commuter trains running between say whitefiled to SBC / Yelahanka to SBC. Yelahanka bound trains can also be routed via Yeshwantpur to SBC if we indeed need the trains to reach SBC.

This may be inconvenient to many passengers especially for the old age people, people with kids and people with luggage. But, just a thought.

If we move City station out to 2-3 satellite stations, we can free SWR tracks inside the city.

Take an auto/shuttle/bus to nearest station

• Going towards Chennai? Then take a rail to Whitefield station.
• Going towards Hyderabad/Delhi? take a rail to Airport station
• Going towards Mysore/Mangalore/Hubli? Go to Kengeri

Going to this multi-satellite station arrangement may require building new peripheral ring tracks around the city (analogous to Peripheral Ring Road). this ring rail could connect these satellite stations.

The argument against such a thing, or any such transportation routing reform is - you are adding interchange points in the system. But hey, developing smooth interchange points is the foundation on which good transportation systems are developed. How long can we keep avoinding focusing on this foundational aspect?

Bottomline, we need to think hard to find ways of using Railway tracks inside the city. What I have said above is one such thought, may not be the best idea - I am okay with that. But tracks inside the city can't be wasted only on long transit purposes.

Past post with similar thoughts: "Edge stations ..."

An example of transport integration with changeover from Metro to Long distance train. Sameway we should have the long distance starting next to the Local train with a common platform. Platforms for the local should be built on either sides. On the other side of the platform, arriving train can stop.

SB, Vasanth - Noted your comments.

I feel that there is a good chance to make this work well if BMRC is to operate the services with some of SWR's infrastructure & land adjacent their tracks. Expecting SWR to operate an urban rail (they have no experience in this) maybe similar to asking a train driver used to long haul trains to suddenly start operating Metro trains also alternately !

Also, introduction of a new entity into urban transport & expecting all of them to co-ordinate based on customer needs & meet demands & well - you know how the various government bodies co-ordinate.

These are the same reasons why the Chennai MRTS is still running nearly empty - I was tempted to board a train at Annanagar in Chennai recently, but my sources advised me that bus was better as the train stations are too far from bus stops & that I might have to take an auto when I had to transfer to a bus ! We do not want these sort of mistakes here, for sure.

If we want to demand a system, the entire focus has to be on the users, as jennypinto very rightly points out. Unless most, if not all the stations are positioned in such a manner that it is easy for commuters to transfer to other modes without inconveniences or is an activity center by itself in some high density surroundings, the utility will be poor & it will effect the system's operation badly, as it has done in Chennai & other cities.

Based on the above, & looking at the rail map, I note that the only routes worthwhile for operating frequent urban metro services are as follows :

1) Kengeri to City Stn - 13 km

2) City Stn to Whitefield (via Cant R'ly Stn & Baiyyappanahalli) - 24 km

3) City Stn to Baiyyappanahalli (via Hebbal) - 23 km

4) Lottegollahalli to Yelahanka - 7 km

5) Banaswadi to Chandapura (via Bellandur) - 25 km appx

The other routes recommended in the CTTP could remain under SWR's domain as they are all from BMA boundary to nearby towns & would qualify as suburban services.

The five routes above add up to about 92 km, but construction costs would be much lesser than elevated routes. There will be some land acquisition (for trackage, stations & other rail infrastructure & for approach road improvements at stations), but there will not be any viaduct construction (No disruptions, too !).

If regular Metros operate along these routes, the possibility to create satellite inter-city rail stations increases, & decongestion of city centers would become a reality, too.

Thus, the problems that will need to be overcome are :

1) Metro tracks (including width) & also signalling are quite different & the trains will need separate infrastructure to be created at grade.

2) Station locations & approaches for roads will need to be identified since bus services have to reach the stations.

3) Metro (Ph-2) & also Monorail, if there is going to be one will need to be realigned to avoid duplication & to integrate with these new Metro routes.

Manish,

You seem very positive about SWR not operating a CRS in Bangalore based on Railway Board's decision. I was suspecting that some such development might occur after the Chennai fiasco & I reckon, the Hyderabad MRTS has also been losing money heavily, not to mention Delhi & Kolkata, which have also been performing poorly.

Anyway, SWR has lent some of it's land infrastructure for development of NM along the Swastik~Malleswaram alignment, is'nt it ?

Similarly, I would think they can at least part with land adjacent their present tracks to allow NM to run surface trains by the side of their alignments.

If NM has to be quickly developed on it's own all across the city, there will be too much disruption with heavy costs & funding will be a major obstacle, not to mention agitation by land losers as much more land will be necessary, I'm sure for such a development.

If quick solutions are to be found, this may be the only answer, though alignment suitability will remain a big question mark.

SB_YPR, To quote:

... The railways will henceforth focus only on medium, long-distance passenger traffic and freight traffic, while leaving short-distance suburban services to local authorities such as Metro Rail corporations ...

Their decision is about them leaving short distance service to local authorities and not doing it themselves directly. Railway's goal is to focus on long distance transportation, fair enough. They don't need to hang on to their assets in the center of the city to meet that goal. Railways is a public corporation, and their assets are our assets.

All they have to do is to state that they are okay letting Metro Rail Corp, or a new Venture make use of their tracks in the city. Just sell out your tracks inthe city to Metro Rail, or a new company or PPP, and in return for agreeing to do so, GoK or the new company will give you land on the outskirts for brand new world class stations.

Its a bit like the Army who have a lot of landmass in the city and some argue about the value in Army holding on to them in present days. Railways is not like Army, its a civilian public sector corporation.

Naveen, yes, fair enough. I think commuter Rail is a bit of a misnomer here. the point is about making use of SW Railway's tracks etc to solve our city's problem. There are various models available.