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Consolidated list of suggestions for BMTC meeting tomorrow!

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BusPublic Transport

Please leave a comment if you think somthing is missed out so that we can include it.

Though I would like to remind everyone that this is a list of Suggestions and not not questions.
Also do not point out problems but give solutions to the problem that BMTC can work on.

 

SUGGESTIONS:

Availability of Routes Information
1.) The BMTC enquiry offices should be manned by trained and knowledgeable senior staff who really know the BMTC routes.
enquiry no. 12667 have no knowledge and they invariably reply that the information is not available on their computer!
2.) A separate time table for each route with route map may be printed and sold for a nominal price of say, 50P. (such individual route time tables are distributed free at the Information/Help Desks of Public Transport abroad).
3.) Wide publicity to the routes and timings of the high end buses through newspapers
4.) Bus shelters should provide bus route and timing information.
5.)timings and routes of all the bus routes/services are published properly in bus guides


Routes/ Servies:
1.) last mile connectivity, i.e. from residence/work place to bus stop of high end bus routes .MINI BUSES private operators should be deployed
2.) The Volvo or similar services should be provided for all Railway stations, as is being done for BIAL airport.
3.) Bus stops should be properly named, there are 4 bus stops named "jaksandra"
4.) Move away from Hub-Spoke transportation system And switch to Grid transportation system
5.) do NOT add any further buses to the roads. Instead re-plan the routes area-wise, merge 4-6 routes into one route and provide one feeder to service the the other areas in the vicinity.
6.)run only minibuses on sanjaynagar main road as the blue buses are unable to move around if there are are even minor obstructions.
7.)We should deploy mini buses in our streets so interior areas are not neglected for lack of manouverable buses.

 

Schedule/Timings
1.) Increase the buses during the peak hour (7.30AM to 10.30 AM) and 4 to 9 PM. Currently maximum buses ply between 10.30 AM and 5.30 (General shift is 10-6) PM
2.)Figure out a way to avoid buses on the same route arriving at a stop at the same time. Make them run at a more regular frequency. One way to do this is throttling them at the starting point, that is delay the departure of a bus slightly if the previous one left very late.

I would encourage taking up the cause of priority bus lanes.
 

Ticket Fare, Passes
1.) Let the ticketing system be based on duration of the journey. The validity of ticket can be 1 to 3 hours from the time it is issued and any number of transfers should be allowed within that time frame.
2.)Issue the tickets before boarding the bus so that it eliminates the problem of not having adequate change in the bus and the subsequent fight with the conductor.
 


Bus Stops, Route Support Infrastructure
1.)Install a stop request button near the rear door. This will allow people at the rear to get out without winding their way to the front through a crowded bus. Once the button is pressed an indicator should light up confirming that the request has been registered. In fact I am surprised that the Volvo buses don’t have this feature after costing a fortune.
2.)Improve the scrolling destination displays so that they provide the bilingual information in a concise manner. Each iteration of the two languages should ideally complete within a few seconds. Currently some of them (usually the Kannada version) take ages to go through one loop and it is not possible to make out the destination quickly.
3.) Priority should be to build smaller but more functional bus stations with good toilets, bus bays and reasonable seats/standing place at major junctions - Silk Board, Marathahally, Jalahally cross, Hebbal junction, KR Puram, Jayadeva Hospital, MG Road etc.
4.)All buses at least new buses should have power steering, power breaks and smoother gear boxes, BMTC can spend little more money and push suppliers to do it.
5.)buses dont have luggage racks
6.)music played during teh journey.
7.)BMTC was the first transport companies to launch the door system to urban buses in India but today most of the Drivers are not closing the doors at all which is a very dangerous situtation
8.)There should be clear direction boards mentioning the destinations. For example a new comer may wait on the opposite side ( eg. A person may wait in Agar on the wrong side to go to Jayadev Hospital or Banashankari ).
9.)
Most buses are prematurely old and accident scarred. There is need for proper and regular maintenance.
10.)
Driver-cum-Conductor  Buses. They are slow, lead to wastage of diesel, increase pollution and hinder the the traffic. Most importantly they are very dangerous as teh driver is always distracted.

Buses:
1.) buses catering to the majority of the commuters are unkempt,
2.) window glasses are either broken or dirty and untouchable with dried vomit sticking on the glass panels, on the floor and outside the windows,
3.) floors are not swept and lots of dirt keeps circulating inside the bus endangering the health of commuters and creating allergic conditions,
4.) drivers seat and his area of operation are despicable,
5.)first aid box does not exist or if it exists, is either empty or god knows what is inside,
6.) poor visibility of name boards, front board shows a destination and the back board shows some other destination,
7.)name board does not have a proper light,
8.) lighting inside the bus is very dim and we have seen conductor struggling to remove proper change from his bag or to make entries,  
9.) most of red board buses running on mofusil routes are old rickety buses that rattle and make horrible sounds, they are withdrawn periodically to the workshop to get a fresh coat of paint over the peeling paint only in the interiors,
10.) those who are sitting in the front seats have to breath the unhealthy hot air that escapes through the poorly fitted rickety covers of the engine bonnet,

Suggestions for drivers while driving

  1. Strictly ensure that the buses remain in the left lane when they approach any bus stop.
  2. Stop exactly at the bus shelter and do not make people run behind the bus. If there is no bus shelter, then BMTC should install a pole which indicates the exact location of the bus stand. The bus should stop with its front door within a couple of feet from this pole.
  3. Stop the bus such that it is as close as possible to the bus shelter, so that the passengers can step into the bus directly from the bus shelter. If there is no bus shelter, then stop close to the foot path. With the maneuverability that a Volvo provides this should be trivial for the drivers to do this.
  4. If there is a bus already stopped at the bus stand, then wait for it leave and then approach the bus stand. Also ensure that there is no passenger waiting to board the bus before the bus proceeds. Never overtake the stopped bus and go ahead of the bus thus forcing the passengers to run behind the bus.
  5. The Bus Stops on the route should be announced by the Driver and much before the Bus reaches the stop. The Conductor is often busy issuing tickets. It creates problems especially in the  in the late evenings when the bus is overcrowded and one cannot make out the Bus Stop. A small mike will do.
  6. BMTC bus drivers doesn't follow traffic rules, they don't see the RED light to stop their big vehicle.
  7. BMTC bus try to overtake this stopped bus from right and stand in front of this bus. During process of overtaking, the other bus always get jammed in between, also cause other vehicles to stop as well and cause a lot of traffic jam in that particular area.
  8. if you have to turn left, you should stand in leftmost lane, and if you have to take right, you should stop on rightmost lane, but  BMTC buses do stand wherever they find space and move forward, and when they have to take turn, they take left turn far away from the rightmost lane, and right turn far away from the leftmost lane. (Go to HSR layout(BDA comp)-koramangala junction while coming from agara lake towards BTM, you can see it yourselves.)

 First Hand Experience

  1. The officers of all grades should be made to travel incognition on few routes once in a month to get a first hand experience.
  2. Conductors and drivers should alos be involved in decision making process. Their grass route exepreince is invaluable.


 Questions:

1. Was a due diligence survey conducted for projection of load, optimum utilisation, break even, before purchase orders placed?

2. Numbers (different luxury makes only) 
 approved, 
orders placed,
delivered,
nos on road, 
total cost,
idling,
gross/net income derived for the past 3 years,
number of pending orders, 
whetherJnNURM funded or from its own funds, 
if incurring loss, why can't fresh orders be suspended, if not, why not?

3.) is any reliable data available to quantify the benefits accrued by running such luxury buses - like reduction of cars etc., on road? If so, figures thereof, if not, why not or what is proposed to be done?

4.) is atal service a success? 

5) How many drivers hired actually got a proper driving training about safety, traffic rules i.e. basic road-sense?

6) Do we really have designated bus stops? If yes, why are not they maintained properly (Clean and visible). And if they are maintained also, then why doesn't bus stop at the designated bus-stops?

7) No. of officers/top managers who are allotted official cars.

8) No. of other officials/staff paid car allownce

9) No. of officials/staff paid two wheeler allownce

10) No. of the above people who have changed over to BMTC buses.

11.) Fleet/route rationalisation
what are the plans to reduce the number of routes

12.) Volvo are an overkill in terms of luxury then why buy more of those?

 

 

GENEARL SUGGESTION ON DIVISION OF SERVICES

classify the roads into 4-5 categories and provide different services on different roads.

* Arterial/Radial roads : Presently, we have the Big10 service service running on these roads which are wide and very long (each road over 5-8 kms long) Eg: Mysore road, Bannergatta road, hosur road etc.. We may consider running more vestibules (janti-vaahana) on these roads, since they are long straight roads, without many turns.

* Throughfares : These are roads that are not necessarily as wide. Some of these may be one-ways, but these carry large amounts of traffic and are about 3-5 kms long. (Eg : Malleshwaram Sampige road, Vijayanagara/Rajajinagara Chord road. These roads carry two lanes of traffic in each direction. The actual destination of the majority of the users are a few kms away from the road (Sampige road used by people going to Mathikere/Vidyaranyapura etc). You will not find any bus terminus on these roads, but they will carry a very high frequency of buses (one every 30 sec-2 mins).

* Local Thoughfare: These roads are the about 30-40 feet wide and 2-4 kms long. These are destinations in themselves. Examples could include Sanjaynagar main road (destinations there include Sanjaynagar,Nagashettihalli ) and Hanumantanagar 50feet road (destinations include Srinagara, girinagar etc). These will hence be good cases for having terminal bus stops. Frequency of buses on these road could be one every 3-10 mins.

* Then there are are innumebrable hallis in Bangalore and each of these Hallis will have the *****halli Main road, which will be not more than 30 ft wide. Add to it, they will not be straight, so running buses on these roads at a freqency of 20-40 mins, which end up clogging the road, may not be a good idea.This is the best case for us to take up mini-buses (Swaraj Mazda, tata starbus etc) and operate them at higher freqencies (10-20 mins) till the nearest main road. These should be connected to Majestic only once in 2-3 hrs, so that people will start using the feeder buses.

* then there would be some non-bussable residential roads, which would not figure on the BMTC map.


 

Comments

kbsyed61's picture

Add the questions too!

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Manjari,

Thanks for taking time to consolidate the suggestions. I would suggest you add questions to the list or make separate document with list of questions. These questions could be used for filing RTI's if need arises.

Syed

pathykv's picture

BMTC meeting

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Dear Manjari,

I agree with Mr. Syed.

All other points in the form of questions stc. may be made into a separate list. We will hand over to BMTC.

We should not loose them as many people have spent time to post them.

K.V.Pathy

kbsyed61's picture

KVPathy Sir, Can you help consolidate questions?

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KVPathy Sir,

Could you pls help in consolidate all the questions? You might categorize it appropriately and hand them over to BMTC officials tomorrow.

Syed

Vasanthkumar Mysoremath's picture

Pathy Sir, u know the pains of a BTS commuter...remember?

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Manjariji, Syed bhai,

you have done your best and I must really appreciate your effort (5 per cent of India's popuation that faught for Independence) while we have more than 1000 prajas (95 per cent enjoying it), if they are really travelling by ordinary blue buses.

Will wait for the outcome ... hope it will not receive another reponse from BMTC like the April 2009 post where BMTC has sent an unsigned, undated note without a file number from its office.

No complaints.... only solutions ?  Good - but is the monopolistic monolithic BMTC heading for perpetual loss making and eventually a fit case for BIFR (Board for Industrial and Financial Reconstruction of loss making/sick government companies) and paving the way for privatisation? 

- vasanth mysoremath    

sanjayv's picture

slight reword suggestion

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Great list of suggestions here.  May I suggest a slight addition to the suggestion about driver cum conductor buses.  Those buses are, in addition to the points used here, dangerous .  Droiver only buses should only be on trips which are pass only or when the passengers are able to buy a ticket in advance of the journey.  

idontspam's picture

The pain called BTS

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We are rid of the name atleast. I think one of the important things for BMTC to do is phase out the monster blue buses. These underbuilt monster boxes thrust upon the public causing nuisance to the streets of Bangalore depict the troubles India has gone through for the past 63 years. It has kept Bangalore in the dark ages. It reminds me of the people whose minds are tied to berry picking servitude of the ice age. Hope we can move ahead with world class engineering and provide more menouverable buses which the drivers can push through the streets of Bangalore and provide more comfort, reach and connectivity to the common folk.

Srivatsava's picture

Classsifying roads to determine service

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Manjari,

In Bangalore, we have a large number of roads, a vast majority of them being really narrow ones. What we need to do is to classify the roads into 4-5 categories and provide different services on different roads.

* Arterial/Radial roads : Presently, we have the Big10 service service running on these roads which are wide and very long (each road over 5-8 kms long) Eg: Mysore road, Bannergatta road, hosur road etc.. We may consider running more vestibules (janti-vaahana) on these roads, since they are long straight roads, without many turns.

* Throughfares : These are roads that are not necessarily as wide. Some of these may be one-ways, but these carry large amounts of traffic and are about 3-5 kms long. (Eg : Malleshwaram Sampige road, Vijayanagara/Rajajinagara Chord road. These roads carry two lanes of traffic in each direction. The actual destination of the majority of the users are a few kms away from the road (Sampige road used by people going to Mathikere/Vidyaranyapura etc). You will not find any bus terminus on these roads, but they will carry a very high frequency of buses (one every 30 sec-2 mins).

* Local Thoughfare: These roads are the about 30-40 feet wide and 2-4 kms long. These are destinations in themselves. Examples could include Sanjaynagar main road (destinations there include Sanjaynagar,Nagashettihalli ) and Hanumantanagar 50feet road (destinations include Srinagara, girinagar etc). These will hence be good cases for having terminal bus stops. Frequency of buses on these road could be one every 3-10 mins.

* Then there are are innumebrable hallis in Bangalore and each of these Hallis will have the *****halli Main road, which will be not more than 30 ft wide. Add to it, they will not be straight, so running buses on these roads at a freqency of 20-40 mins, which end up clogging the road, may not be a good idea.This is the best case for us to take up mini-buses (Swaraj Mazda, tata starbus etc) and operate them at higher freqencies (10-20 mins) till the nearest main road. These should be connected to Majestic only once in 2-3 hrs, so that people will start using the feeder buses.

* then there would be some non-bussable residential roads, which would not figure on the BMTC map.

So, basic point is, the width of the road, length of the road etc should determine the kind of service/bus provided on that road.

-Srivatsava V

Srivatsava's picture

Fleet management/rationalisation

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I dont know if we should raise this a question or sugeestion. Fleet/route rationalisation is tooo important a topic to be left out.

I would love to talk/hear about BMTCs plans on how they are planning to reduce the number of routes. Recently, I brought a bus guide, which was very difficult to understand. The problem was, if the timings and routes of all the bus routes/services are published properly, it will not be a book but an epic like Ramayana!!

So, the core of BMTC appproach to the future should be to ensure that they do NOT add any further buses to the roads. Instead, they should re-plan the routes area-wise, merge 4-6 routes into one route and provide one feeder to service the the other areas in the vicinity.

That will ensure that BMTC will be able to provide bus services with high frequency, lesser number of routes, and with lesser numebr of buses! All these will only make the travel faster!!

-Srivatsava V

idontspam's picture

 Fleet/route rationalisation

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 Fleet/route rationalisation is tooo important a topic to be left out.

I dont know how hard they are trying but I feel this is a political issue and they may not be able to do it as long as they remain within govt control. 

idontspam's picture

Small roads and BMTC buses

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  Examples could include Sanjaynagar main road (destinations there include Sanjaynagar,Nagashettihalli )

I had long back suggested that they run only minibuses on sanjaynagar main road as the blue buses are unable to move around if there are are even minor obstructions. Then I saw the same sized streets being served by Volvo and Scania articulated (janti vahana) buses in stockholm. I am not sure if TATA/AL makes buses with same specifications. Their turn radius and manouverability is amazing that they squeeze between cars and park close to the kerb. We should deploy such buses in our streets so interior areas are not neglected for lack of manouverable buses. Of course no buses can get into balepet/chickpet streets

kbsyed61's picture

Rationlaization is covered in the Presentation!

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Fleet/route rationalisation is tooo important a topic to be left out.

Srivatsava,

 The presentation adequately covers this important topic of route rationalization. I think that is the crux of all Praja discussion on BMTC. Please do not hesitate to raise this issue at the meeting but in a right context.

I totally agree with you on stop adding new buses and routes. This is also a one of the main points in the presentation. Advice to BMTC is stop doling out short term solutions rather go for long term solutions.

IDS,

 You are right. route rationalization is very touchy subject and also a very challenging too. You can always design a new plan, modifying the old one is always a pain and a challenge.

Vasanthkumar Mysoremath's picture

my two paise

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Manjari-ji / Syed Bhai,

 

My two paise:

1. The list is very good (conditions apply) and my personal feeling is, the list touches upon mostly  peripherial needs of commuters - how?

Because most these facilities and amenities sought sought to be dicussed in the meeting on 28th August 2009 with BMTC, as deficiencies in service can be stated to be associated with an otherwise efficient commuting system, if in place, that is catering to all classes of commuters.  

When there is a high level stratification and spread of available resources for Volvos across the board, can it be called 'an efficient social sector transportation infrastructure?'

2.   The following is the 'cut and paste' from the list of feed backs and suggestions given by prajas to BMTC on 28th April 2009 - pertains to Volvos NOT ORDINARY COMMUTING BUSES.

Could the Praja Team ask BMTC on 28th august 2009  what happened to these two points?

3.   Feedback:

a.       There is lot of redundancy in Volvo routes

b.      Volvo service doesn’t cover all areas. c.       Volvo routes are not planned well to suite the commuters from areas which are not connected directly to choose an option of connecting from nearest bus station/changeover.

 

- Vasanth Mysoremath

Suggestions:    

a.       Got to be clear on "positioning" of Volvo service. Don't push Volvo for city wide connectivity, it may not be possible to promise an upper tier service that will take you anywhere to anywhere, not needed, and not feasible. b.      Volvo started as "commuting alternative" for car users, it should stick to that - commuter chariot for select industrial areas. But even there, promise end to end connectivity via "connection" with other BMTC services. What I mean to say is - have trunk routes to ITPL, E-City, Airport, but promote "connecting" to these trunk long-haul routes via Big10, upcoming local shuttles etc. going down the path of "I will provide Volvo from every corner of city to ITPL or Airport" is not possible, not doable.

8.  BMTC’s Clear Strategy Feedback: a.       There is no clear strategy visible from BMTC side on positioning Volvo service. Suggestions: a.       What exactly is BMTC's game plan here? b.       If the intent of the subsidy is to move the car and 2-wheeler users into buses, when will the subsidy end, and when it does end will the Volvo fare be 10-15 times that of the ordinary bus?

c.       The Volvo is serious overkill in terms of luxury. Isn't it time to stop buying these buses and opt for cheaper ones even for the luxury service?

d.      If BMTC agrees with point 3, why is it in the process of buying 200 more Volvos (if I got the figure right)?

 

manjari's picture

Add the questions too!

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I have added a seperate section for questions

manjari's picture

slight reword suggestion

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I couldnt agree more about the point that driver- cum conductor system is very dangerous. I have added that to the suggestion.

pathykv's picture

Questions

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Dear Mr. Syed,

Manjari has added all important questions.

The entire document is quite exhaustive.

Hope we will get time to present these points and discuss them.

We may go further after getting BMTC response.

K.V.Pathy

manjari's picture

Hi Mr. Vasanth I think you

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Hi Mr. Vasanth

I think you have pointed out very correctly about their feedback on

a.       There is lot of redundancy in Volvo routes

b.      Volvo service doesn’t cover all areas.

c.       Volvo routes are not planned well to suite the commuters from areas which are not connected directly to choose an option of connecting from nearest bus station/changeover.

 

And the question as to why they are buying more volvo if the agree that "The Volvo is serious overkill in terms of luxury"

I have included these in the list of questions and I have also included other questions you had posted earlier

Do let me know if I have missed out anything

-Manjari

 

manjari's picture

Is anything missing

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I have added almost everything I could in the list.

But there were a lot of people who suggested that buses should keep to teh left and about the stops etc so I might have missed out something.
Please let me know if anyone thinks something is misssing

Thanks,
Manjari

j_venu's picture

my Suggestions regarding Schedule.

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I have few Suggestions regarding Schedule Availabity.
-----------------------------

1. The Schedule Information Available at the BMTC Website. Take Steps to make it popular.
   very Less People are know about this site. My Suggestion is to Boldly Advertize the
   BMTC  website inside and outside the Bus, to get BMTC related Information. Provide
   Special Emphasis on Schedule.
 
   Currently one can obtain the Schedule at


 for Eg: http://www.bmtcinfo.com/english/v500a.html

  
 We can have the same, 
  
 http://www.bmtcinfo.com/schedule

 so that people can remember easily.


 Also put a Board near the Driver's Cabin and Rear Entrance Area Displaying The Schedule Information  for the current Route.

  

2. Provide  Training to VOLVO Drivers and conductors focussed from the perspective of Volvo Customers.
   Most of whom i have interacted need a mindset change.

 

3. Ensure that TC's , Drivers and Conductors Get special incentives for Maintaining the Schedule along with
   the Number of People they Ply.


4. Rationalize or Change the Schedule Timing for the Specific route, based on feedback from Customers,
   Drivers and TC's. 


5. Make People more aware about the "Go Green Go BMTC". Send Mailers ,  Put Posters near Offices,   Routes,  Create more awareness.

regards,

Venu

dvsquare's picture

List looks good

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The list looks good.

 

Where exactly we are going to meet today?

I mean, I know the BMTC bus stop, but after reaching there, whom to contact etc?

idontspam's picture

Bus stop naming convention

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In some countries they name the stops after the nearest cross street instead of landmarks. We have our own example in malleshwaram (on sampige or margosa the stop names are 11th, 13th, 18th cross etc). We should extend this to all over the city

Vasanthkumar Mysoremath's picture

Request to all prajas - please spare one hour today evening-

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Dear All

Numbers does matter - as you all know Mr.Syed, Manjari and others have slogged and hammered the material into a shape ... and unfortunately, even now prajegalu are posting their wish list.

Since it is necessary to impress that prajegalu are concerned about how their travel needs have to be catered by BMTC and they mean business this time, it is necessary to be present in large numbers... i wish I had not been affected with cold so that I could hve made it to the venue from Mysore.  Tomorrow... it will be Mysore.  

Over to you prajegale... maha janagale.. 'being there' is what matters.. days have come with a message - more the merrier to tackle our problems...

my two paise: it is my money, it is my menu and serve me what I want - will be happy with two course meal and at my cost do not serve a twenty course meal with 5 course desert thrown in to those who are on strict diet....!!.

IDS sir

/monstruous blue buses..../   Ye.. tu.. brute?  Remember Shakespear?

- vasanth mysoremath 

idontspam's picture

PT mission

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 even now prajegalu are posting their wish list.

We need to ensure BMTC focuses more on reach and punctuality. If this can be prioritized as a mission then they will be able to get more people to use PT. Obviously this will require them to take a hard look at their routing and ability to keep up times. 

Naveen's picture

Better Buses - The Way Forward

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Then I saw the same sized streets being served by Volvo and Scania articulated (janti vahana) buses in stockholm.

Their turn radius and manouverability is amazing that they squeeze between cars and park close to the kerb. We should deploy such buses in our streets so interior areas are not neglected for lack of manouverable buses.

As discussed here, the way ahead is to get more & more buses that are designed with better passenger comfort/s & better maneuverability in narrow streets or sections of streets, instead of buses built on truck chassis, that are uncomfortable.

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