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Volvo Service - Suggestions to BMTC!

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Public Transport

Good to see a positive attitude from BMTC in soliciting feedback and suggestions from public. I commend their new thinking and a positive approach.

For any public service to be popular, it should offer the larger section of the population with reliable service, reasonably priced and excellent customer friendly service. BMTC can make their service popular and increase the ridership by incorporating each of the above said ingredients in their planning, design and operation process. They should also have a mechanism to measure the quality of each of these ingredients that defines the service. These are valid for every kind of service that BMTC is currently offering, not restricted to volvo and Vayu Vajra service.

For Volvo specific service, here is a very list of suggestions that BMTC could incorporate to increase the ridership and area of operation:

  • Availability of information - Information should be current and up to date on all the BMTC resources
    • BMTC should make available the current information on all its services on its website, via tele-enquiry service, at bus stops, BIAL, Railway stations and KSRTC bus stations.
    • BMTC should provide the latest info w.r.t Volvo routes, its detailed route, Stops, route map, schedule timings and current fare.
  • Timings - Volvo should be operated that suites the public needs
    • BMTC must run its volvo service that would meet the need of public for their daily commute. The timings should be such that people can reliably reach their office/factory/business destinations by morning start time like 7 AM, 8 AM, 9 AM schedules and in evening return by 4 PM, 5 PM, 6 PM, 7 PM and 8 PM schedule. What it means is they should start early by 6 AM and run late into 9 or 10 PM schedule.
  • Increased Frequency - That fits the traffic volumes in morning, evening and holiday schedule
    • These must be run at very high frequency of not more than 15-20 minutes.
  • Reasonable Priced - Ticket fare must be reasonable priced
    • The ticket fare must be reasonable and affordable to majority of the city population.
    • Ticket fare to be fixed on high volume, low price basis
    • Must encourage use of monthly/quarterly passes
    • Encourage corporates with discounted monthly passes for their employees.
    • Reduced price on Weekends and on national holidays
  • Bus stops and route infrastructure
    • BMTC should ensure that its Volvo service takes most desirable route.
    • BMTC must ensure that Volvo buses stops at the bus stops
    • It is BMTC's responsibility to make sure that its bus stops, bus stations, TTMCs are kept clean, well lit and hygienic.
    • BMTC should work with Traffic Police and BBMP to ensure that the routes are enforced with rules giving priority to PT buses. i.e. banning private cars/vehicles on smaller roads, banning parking on congested roads etc.
  • Advertisement - For current routes and upcoming routes
    • BMTC should have separate team that would look after the Advertisement Campaign for creating AD material and its distribution - Both in Paper and electronic form
    • Advertise inside the BMTC buses - On All types of Buses
    • Advertise on TICKETS, PASSES etc.
    • Advertise on Volvo Buses
    • Encourage private corporate sponsorship for ADs popularizing Volvo service
    • Put advertisement boards on Pillars and walls of BMTC bus stations
    • Advertise in Railway stations, Airport and KSRTC bus stations
    • Reach out to the Human Resources department of all the corporates to display the Volvo Service info on their BULLETIN BOARDS and on their company INTRANET web pages.
    • Work with Business chambers for help with sponsorship, advertisements, seminars and workshops.
    • Reach out to IT/BT parks like ITPL, Electronic City associations, Peenya Industrial association to display in their bulletin boards.
    • Advertise in CCTVs present in MALLs, Railway Station and KSRTC bus stations
    • Ads on Radio/TV - May be sponsorship from corporates
  • Feedback / Customer Service
    • Exclusive feedback mechanism by email/phone/post for public submit their feedback, suggestions and criticism.
    • Every feedback must get a response irrespective of BMTCs decision.
  • Make public an important stake holder in BMTC
    • Public feedback/opinion should be taken on all the upcoming new service, new routes and new schedule.
    • All the new services, routes must be announced well in advance.
    • Make public participation a requirement in all the public related operational process.
    • Encourage BMTC admin, public interaction.
    • Also make the BMTC's operational staff (drivers, conductors, supervisors etc) to be part of the service decisions.

I do hope that, this list covers all the major aspects of BMTC's volvo service. I also hope that BMTC would welcome all these suggestions and incorporate all of them to make their volvo service both popular and increase in ridership.

 

Comments

idontspam's picture

Mark bus stops

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It is necessary for BMTC to mark ALL busstops. Even a simple pole like the one in the picture is sufficient. Even if it there is a possibility of the stop being shifted its only a bolt on pole which can be moved. It can be really unpleasant experience without signs. Maybe the drivers dont stop at most places because there is no sign indicating there is a stop.

Bus stop sign

dig's picture

Monthly pass for volvo

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Availability of monthly pass is a major issue. Pass renewal is possible only on last 3-4 days if one goes to Majestic.

BMTC should make volvo monthly pass available in all  of its centers/ bus depos.



kbsyed61's picture

Number of Volvo Schedules on a single route!

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BMTC website has some info on Volvo site - http://www.bmtcinfo.com/english/volvo.htm

Looking at the table, I am bit dumb founded to find that there are number of routes whose schedule is mentioned to be 1 or 2 schedules per day.

Example - V 25 A, V 210 IA, V JPV 10, V 356 N/S, V 600KA, V 210 G

If this is correct, then would be interesting to know the reason for having only 1 or 2 schedule per day. There are other routes that 20, 27 schedules per day.

It is very interesting all the Volvo routes are for South Bangalore, except for 3 routes? Is this adicsrimination by design or demand?

kbsyed61's picture

KG Bus Station to J P Nagar - It's only Rs. 25 in Volvo!

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I can't believe what I saw on BMTC website about Volvo ticket fare from KG Bus Station to J P Nagar 6th Phase to cost only Rs.25/- ?

Can anybody confirm this?

UP (KBS to JP Nagar 6th Phase)

DOWN (JP Nagar 6th Phase to KBS)

Fare Stage

Place

      Fare

Fare Stage

Place

     Fare
           

1.

Kempegowda Bus Station

0.00

  1. 

J.P.Nagara 6th Phase

0.00

2.

M.R.College/Cauvery Bhavan

10.00

2.

Jn.of 24th Main 9th Cross J.P.Nagara

10.00

3.

Corporation/Town Hall

10.00

3.

Jayanagara 5th Block

10.00

4.

Lalbagh M.Gate/P.K.Circle 15.00
4.
Jayanagara Bus Stn. 15.00

5.

Jayanagara Bus Stn.

15.00

5.

Lalbagh M.Gate/P.K.Circle

15.00

6.

Jayanagara 5th Block

20.00

6.

Corporation/Town Hall

20.00

7.

Jn.of 24th Main 9th Cross J.P.Nagara

20.00

7.

M.R.College/Cauvery Bhavan

20.00

8.

J.P.Nagara 6th Phase

25.00

8.

Kempegowda Bus Station

25.00
                 

 

s_yajaman's picture

Syed - schedules is the number of buses + some suggestions

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Syed,

In BMTC parlance, schedules is the number of buses on a route and not trips.  

First off - the whole assumption here is that we need a Volvo service and that is not under question. 

One of the principles that BMTC needs to think of is that if a Volvo route is there then it needs to run at a particular frequency.  No point having 4 trips a day with 1 bus.  335E is successful because it runs frequently and along an important corridor.  

BMTC cannot please everyone with 224 buses.  ITPL and E-City are good destinations which should be served with Volvos (people working there can pay a premium)

.Here are some suggestions.

a. V402D - 1 bus!!!.  Might as well club this with 285M and terminate it at Yelahanka.  Volvos till Dodaballapur prima facie makes very little sense.  Unless there is strong data that suggests a lot of traffic beyond Yelahanka.

b. Club 600KA, 500N and 500K into 500K and let it run from VJN to ITPL via Ring Road.  Ideal if we can route it somehow via Koramangala by bringing it along Hosur Road and joing back Ring Road via Sarjapur Road.

c. Club V319C into V315 and terminate at KR Puram.  Having another bus from ITPL via OM Road to Majestic somehow makes no sense.  Or have 319C only

d. Terminate V365 on weekdays and non-holidays at Arakere/IIMB so that frequency can improve.  It will serve BG Road.  On holidays extend it to National Park. 

e. Club V360B and V356M and V356 N/S and stop at Attibele.  Check if people really go past E-City a lot.  Or else club with V356N (Narayana Hrudayalaya)

f. Club V500A and V500D and run it from BTM/Jayanagar 9th block/Jayadeva to Hebbal (if really needed).  Who are these people who take this route?  Can't imagine.  Maybe this can be put to better use on a different route

g. Club 201G and 201R. 

h V333P, V333T and V333Z and V331A can use some rationalizing.  With Big 10 now running from Hope Farm side, do we need all these?  Should they all run from Mahalaxmi Lyout to HAL or ITPL?

h. Need one route - Domlur to E-City via IRR and Koramangala.  Koramangala does not feature very prominently on Volvo.  Neither does Indiranagar.

Srivathsa

 

 

Drive safe.  It is not just the car maker which can recall its product.

Naveen's picture

Lot of Duplications

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Yajman - I agree with you. There are a whole lot of duplications with the volvo services (as also regular services). This is probably because they had not been planned scientifically across the city to start with & are based on "requests" or "demands" by public - the "stronger" of these "requests" prevailing over the "weaker" ones.

As you say, many routes could be combined & be made more frequent instead of running diffuse, infrequent services.

As regards Koramangala & Indiranagar, I think there are no strong enough requests as majority use cars.

Mr.Murali could demand one for koramangala & get it immediately, if he has the inclination, but I guess he is planning to start his own service sometime soon !!

SB_YPR's picture

Agree with Srivathsa and Naveen

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Hi,

Plenty of duplications as pointed out by Srivathsa, which could very well be rationalised as mentioned above.

BTW, the Volvos on 333Z/333T have very poor patronage beyond  KBS. The ITPL-KBS sector does well. BMTC's idea was probably to connect residential areas to ITPL, but it seems to have flopped for some reason.

Regards,

~~~~

Manish, Nagarbhavi.

~~~~

Manish.

SB_YPR's picture

Fares

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Syed,

The fare for V2 is accurate. It costs only Rs. 25 from KBS to JP Nagar. In fact, the fares on 'non-IT' routes are quite low. It costs only Rs. 20 from Vijayanagar to Jayanagar, and despite having two IT parks on its route 201-R is classified as a non-IT route, hence the fare from C.V. Raman Nagar to Jayanagar is only Rs. 25.

Regards,

~~~~

Manish, Nagarbhavi.

~~~~

Manish.

binaiks's picture

Can't agree on this...

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Hello Srivathsa,

I cant agree even slightly to many portions in your post. Following are my observations:

 (Quoted portions in Italics)

b. Club 600KA, 500N and 500K into 500K and let it run from VJN to ITPL via Ring Road.  Ideal if we can route it somehow via Koramangala by bringing it along Hosur Road and joing back Ring Road via Sarjapur Road.

### 600 KA runs from Vijayanagara to Electronic City Phase-2. How on earth would passengers be benefited it this service is merged with 500K? 

500N and 500K take different routes between Agara and Jayadeva Hospital. 500N is operated via Sarjapur Road Junction -> Madivala Market -> St Johns -> Forum -> Dairy Circle -> Jayadeva Hospital.

500K runs via ORR -> Silk Board ->BTM Layout -> Jayadeva Hospital.

Merging all these into one will surely not make sense. 500N usually operates only during peak hours, and I have never seen these buses go empty

d. Terminate V365 on weekdays and non-holidays at Arakere/IIMB so that frequency can improve.  It will serve BG Road.  On holidays extend it to National Park. 

### Only about 25-30% of the crowd gets down at Arakere. I stay close to Arakere, and travel daily from Shantinagar to Arakere. These bsues have to go atleast till Gottigere. These services have to be operated for longer time - not just 8 am to 6 pm. The first bus HAS to leave from Gottigere atleast by 0700, and the last bus to Gottigere should not leave KBS before 2000. Frequency of atleast 15-20 mins should be maintained during morning/evening peak hours.

f. Club V500A and V500D and run it from BTM/Jayanagar 9th block/Jayadeva to Hebbal (if really needed).  Who are these people who take this route?  Can't imagine.  Maybe this can be put to better use on a different route

### V500A and V500D are kind of "milk runs" for BMTC. There are lots of IT institutions on the way, and these buses run full at most times. In fact, services on this route is very irregular. They should work towards making these services more efficient and punctual.
--
Thanks,
Binai Sankar
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Switch to Public Transportation, Save your city
--
Thanks,
Binai Sankar
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Switch to Public Transportation, Save your city
binaiks's picture

Manish, BTW, the Volvos on

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Manish,

BTW, the Volvos on 333Z/333T have very poor patronage beyond  KBS. The ITPL-KBS sector does well. BMTC's idea was probably to connect residential areas to ITPL, but it seems to have flopped for some reason.

### Entering into KBS is cumbersome and that itself contributes to poor patronage. Instead, a passenger on 333T could well change buses at Vijayanagara, and get into a 500K and reach ITPL even before that 333T reaches, say, Domlur!

The fare for V2 is accurate. It costs only Rs. 25 from KBS to JP Nagar. In fact, the fares on 'non-IT' routes are quite low. It costs only Rs. 20 from Vijayanagar to Jayanagar, and despite having two IT parks on its route 201-R is classified as a non-IT route, hence the fare from C.V. Raman Nagar to Jayanagar is only Rs. 25.

### The fare for V2 is inaccurate. Fares for Non-It segments were recently lowered. Accordingly, the revised fare should not be more than Rs. 20. 

--
Thanks,
Binai Sankar
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Switch to Public Transportation, Save your city
--
Thanks,
Binai Sankar
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Switch to Public Transportation, Save your city
kbsyed61's picture

Volvo timings doesn't look right!

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I went through the timings of all the volvo routes that are published on BMTC website and have collected the timings for 1st trip and last trip. From the data, the timings for 1st trip and the last trip doesn't seems to fit the needs of commuters for their daily travel.

For example:

Route # V2's 1st trip  leaves @ 9:45 AM from KGBS

Route # 276 1st trip leaves @ 9:30 AM from KGBS

Route # V210 A 's last trip leaves @ 1525 PM

Route # V368 's last trip leaves @  1630 PM.

It is time BMTC works on readjusting the route timings that fits the needs of the people. This should be one of the low hanging fruit for BMTC to work on. This task needs to be undertaken along with route rationlaization starting with volvo service. It's a complex task, but at this moment it is difficult but doable. If left without doing anything now, later on it might become impossible to bring any change in the routes and timings. Now is the best time to do it. Let's do it.

 

Route # Origin/Destination First Trip Time Last Trip Time
V2 K G BS / J P Nagar 6th Phase 0740 / 0830 1920 / 2010
V JPV 10 KG BS / Avalahalli BDA Park 0925 / 1005 2015 / 1855
V25 K G BS / Kuvempu Nagar 0810 / 0905 1730 / 1825
V 45 G K G BS / BSK 3rd Stage 3rd phase 0835 / 0755 1915 / 1835
V 60 A Vijaynagar / Jayanagar 9th Phase 0810 / 0815 1815 / 1820
V 176 Kavala Byrasandra / Hampi Nagar 0750 / 0900 1545 / 1820
V 195 Chandra Layout / Shivajinagar Bus Station 0810 / 0810 1835 / 1835
V 210 A K G BS / ISRO Layout 0925 /0930 1520 / 1525
V 201 R Srinagara / C V Raman Nagar 0730 / 0920 1645 / 1900
V 210 1A K G BS / Chikkalasandra 0945 / 0835 1925 / 1820
V 252 K G BS / Peenya 2nd Stage 0810 / 0905 1655 / 1815
V258 C  K G BS / Nelamangala 0700 / 0545 2125 / 1940
V 276  K G BS / Vidyanarayanpura 0930 / 1135 2115 /1915
V 276 G Vidyanarayanpura / Electronic City 0710 / 0915 1405 / 1915
V 258 M  K G BS / Doddaballapura 0755 / 0855 1815 / 1615
V 315 K G BS / K R Puram 0800 / 0855 1640 / 1735
V 319 C K G BS / Kadugodi Bus Station N/A N/A
V 331 A SBS / Kadugodi Bus Station 0630 / 0750 2040 / 2200
V 333 P K G BS / ITPL 0730 /0840 1805 / 1945
V 333 T Nagarabhavi BDA complex / Marathahalli 0535 / 0800 1615 / 2355
V 335 E K G BS / Kadugodi Bus Station 0830 / 0955 1805 / 1930
V 356 N/S K G BS / Chnadapur 2000/2130 0400/0520
V 356 C K G BS / Electronic city 0730 / 0920 1655 / 1810
V 356 N K G BS / Naryan Hrudayalaya 0520 / 0640 1840 / 2010
V 360 B K G BS / Attibele 0600 / 0745 1935 / 2110
V 365 K G BS / Bannerghatta National Park 0620 / 0730 1905 / 2040
V 368 SBS / Bannerghatta National Park 0825 / 0945 1750 / 1630
V 411 K Bannerghatta NP / Marathahalli Bridge 1235 / 1050 1730 / 1520
V 500 A Banashankari / Hebbala 0715 / 0850 1625 / 1700
V 500 D Hebbala / Central Silk Board 0730 / 0805 1635 / 1800
V 500 K Vijaynagar / ITPL 0635 / 0835 2020 / 1825
V 500 N Vijaynagar / ITPL 0745 / 0950 1325 / 1815
V 505 Electronic City / ITPL 0620 / 0755 1805 / 1940
V 600 K Vijaynagar / Naryan Hrudayalaya 0730 / 0915 1650 / 1835
V 201 G Jeevanbhimanagara / BSK Bus Station 0715 / 0810 1908 /2005
V 302 F K G BS / BabasabPalya 0800 /0900 1720 /1820
V 356 M K G BS / Anekal 1040 / 0845 1455 / 1300
V 410 D Bommanhalli / Jalahalli Cross N/A N/A
V 500 KA ISCON / ITPL N/A N/A
V 600 KA Vijaynagar / Electronic City Ph-2 N/A N/A
V 333 Z Mahalaxmi Layout / ITPL N/A N/A
402 D KG BS / Yelahanka Sat Town Ph -5 0730 / 0820 1850 / 1950

 

 

s_yajaman's picture

Thanks binaiks

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Binaiks,

We can certainly disagree while having a discussion. 

a. 600KA - It has 1 bus. This will operate once in 3 hrs.   Do you really think a person will wait for this service?

b.If what you say about 500K and 500N is correct and 500N operates only during peak hours, it seems okay.

c.Gottigere vs. Arakere - 2 km - Gottigere is fine.  But do you at least agree that National Park on weekdays is a waste?

d.500A and 500D - irregular possibly because they operate with only 5-6 buses.  Need to understand traffic patterns?  Is it better to terminate it at Marathahalli Bridge?

e. What about the rest?

Syed - those timings in the website might be wrong.  See 335E - with 27 buses it has only some 20 trips marked.  I think there is a bus every 10 mins on 335E.

Srivathsa

Drive safe.  It is not just the car maker which can recall its product.

kbsyed61's picture

BMTC Website should focus on Commuter Information more!

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http://www.bmtcinfo.com/english/index.htm

Many people have complained about BMTC website being not very COMMUTER FRIENDLY. Even my own browsing experience proved those apprehensions. Let me list the some Pluses along with reason for its commuter unfriendliness.

Pluses -

  1. It is live and functional (even though all links are active)
  2. It has tried to combine all the info into one single section
  3. It does lists limited info for the commuters

Minuses -

  1. The home page looks like BMTC to be an engineering company not as a public service provider
  2. The menu items, links, majority of them are not meant for commuters
  3. Even those are present, are not very intuitive/user friendly.
  4. The route search feature should have been on the Home page.
  5. The route search feature only allows for direct service routes entries.
  6. The route search doesn't allow for entering door-to-door route stops.
  7. It doesn't carry the route info brochures in PDF formats for easy printing.

WISHLIST-

  1. BMTC home page should get revamped with more focus on providing the information to commuters with ease and reliability.
  2. The website should present the info in categories with commuter info being in prominence
  3. Commuters should be able to search for direct routes, indirect routes, route maps, fare cards.
  4. Complaints/Suggestion links should be re-written to allow for suggestions also.
  5. Website should become tech savvy to be accessed from hand held devices.
  6. Website to allow online renewal of monthly passes.
  7. Website should be able to provide the current location of a specific routes.
  8. Website should provide the information on delayed services as flash news.

Some examples Public Transport Service's websites:

  1. http://www.vta.org/
  2. http://www.mbta.com/

 

rmb's picture

Can VOLVO take over running this service as well?

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Already they do the maintenance of the buses, let us try getting some efficiency in running the service as well. See the news http://www.noidascoop.com/story/2009/4/7/05056/92658 , NOIDA has AC buses operated by a private company.

Regarding frequency of Volvo routes, it need not be built just by VOLVO buses, by mixing the regular buses with VOLVO on the same routes the frequencey can be increased. Passengers have choice too.

RMB
silkboard's picture

Too big a list Syed

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You have put too many things in your list Syed. Should have provided the suggestions that you think are most critical (relatively speaking). When providing big lists, it is good to provide priorities as well. Plus, I think you have mixed up topline (get more customers) and bottomline (reduce operating costs) suggestions. Good list there, but some items are too generic (how to define "most desirable routes" and "reasonable fare"?) , and some are not Volvo specific or non-feasible for Volvo service (like - very high frequencies - as it is, its argubale if BMTC needs to invest too much in Volvos).

As we learned during our interaction with Ashwin Mahesh, there are a lot of basic nice-to-dos that are known, but practical difficulties limit them. Usually, people look for suggestion that provide creative fix for practical probems. For example, how would BMTC act to "ensure that its Volvo service takes most desirable route"? The whole deal itself is in figuring out the desirable routes! Big10 is an effort in rationalizing routes to make some of them very desirable by design.

Or take up this one "fare must be reasonable and affordable to majority of the city population" Who decides, and how is it decided what is "reasonable" and "affordable" here!?

Didn't mean to belittle your comprehensive suggestions Syed. But I wanted to call out why some members may not have jumped on the thread to add on more suggestions.

So anyway. My list by priority will be

  • Public feedback and data driven decisions on timing and frequency. Decisions should be data or real consumer survey driven. BMTC will do well to engage a professional agency to do a user need and traffic pattern survey on the routes it has identified to be profitable for Volvos
  • Work on bus exchange points to promote the culture of "bus changes". Two needs here - 1) info on important connection points or bus junctions to connect with Volvo or Big10 services 2) work with BBMP to improve these big bus junctions. Bus stops are already coming up at many places, work a bit more to mark out pedestrian points near bus stops, some focused work to keep bus stops clear, information boards showing major routes that come to that stop.
  • Last mile options - encourage tech parks and big companies to run shuttles to and from the nearest Volvo route.
  • Club some Volvos routes with Big10 (OMR Big10, 319c, Varthur Road Big10, 333P and 335E), may be once every 20 mins, a Big10 is Volvo, could be higher frequencies in morning and evening on some routes.
  • Got to be clear on "positioning" of Volvo service. Don't push Volvo for city wide connectivity, it may not be possible to promise an upper tier service that will take you anywhere to anywhere, not needed, and not feasible. Volvo started as "commuting alternative" for car users, it should stick to that - commuter chariot for select industrial areas. But even there, promise end to end connectivity via "connection" with other BMTC services. What I mean to say is - have trunk routes to ITPL, E-City, Airport, but promote "connecting" to these trunk long-haul routes via Big10, upcoming local shuttles etc. going down the path of "I will provide Volvo from every corner of city to ITPL or Airport" is not possible, not doable.
kbsyed61's picture

Sample Brochure with Route Map and Schedule!

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Courtsey - Montgomery County Transit.

s_yajaman's picture

SB - Hubs and Spoke at least for Volvo?

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SB,

Same thought came to me.  We cannot please everyone staying in all parts of Bangalore with 225 or even 400 buses.

Need to clarify with BMTC the objective of Volvo!  Is it to add a profitable segment to their services?  Is it to offer an alternative to car/bike users and get them off the road? 

Which are the key areas that they want to serve?  Put a priority - ITPL, E-City, Vijayanagar, Jayanagar, Yelahanka, Srinagar, Koramangala.   Areas should be decided by some sort of data around commuter preferences, willingness to pay and destinations.

Maybe then define some  key hubs - (they also need to be able to do maintenance here - heard that from Prof Mahesh).  Maybe - KBS (!), ITPL, E-City, Vijayanagar, Yelahanka

Have routes interconnecting these hubs

e.g. Yelahanka to E-City via Marathahalli.   say 5 hrs return trip including break - 25 buses - average - 12 min frequency. 

Vijayanagar to ITPL - via ORR and Marathahalli - 4 hrs return trip - 20-24 buses - 10 min frequency

KBS - ITPL - 335E - leave as it is - 30 buses - 10 mins

KBS - E-City - 356(?) -4 hrs return (take elevated road?) - 24 buses - 10 mins

Yelahanka to ITPL via Hebbal, Cantonment, Ulsoor Lake, OM Road - 4 hrs return - 15 buses - 15 mins

Domlur to E-City via Koramangala - 4 hrs return - 20 buses 12 mins

140 buses used up for these.

Remaining 100 buses use for maybe V18, V201, V36, V402, V252 and local loops to connect nearby areas.

Srivathsa

 

 

Drive safe.  It is not just the car maker which can recall its product.

s_yajaman's picture

Use of NICE Peripheral Road once done for Volvo

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Assuming that there is no more litigation,etc and NICE Peripheral Road gets done end to end should we not route some of the E-City buses via NICE. 

E.g. Vijayanagar to E-City via Mysore Road, ORR and then join up NICE Road as an express service using the link road from ORR. 

WOC Road --> Magadi Road --> NICE Road --> E-City

Jayananagar 4th block --> JP Nagar --> BG Road --> NICE Road to E-City.

This will speed things up for people coming from Bangalore West.

Srivathsa

 

Drive safe.  It is not just the car maker which can recall its product.

murali772's picture

Volvo through K'mangala

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This comment has been moved here.
Muralidhar Rao
Vasanth's picture

Bus Tracking is now available on btis.in but not upto date

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BTIS.in has the bus tracking facility online, but not that accurate.

Tracking through mobile is more preferrable since everyone will not have access to internet and at the same time for those who have net access also, they cannot have it all the time. YI was very good, need it again.

Vasanth's picture

Volvo Consolidation

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Volvo Consoldiation with changeover points is needed to increase the frequency. For example, all the Vijaynagar bound Volvos can come till Banashankari where a TTMC is going to be set. From Banashankari, we can have buses to Bannerghatta, ITPL Via  Jayanagar and Koramangala, ITPL via Ring Road, Electronic City.

Same way 201R can be run from Srinagar till Banashankari from where they can catch buses.

But, one flaw that I see is the reluctance from people to changeover the buses because of the environment in the bus stops. This makes it unattractive compared to a single bus journey.

murali772's picture

typical Yi feedback

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Muralidhar Rao
Naveen's picture

Volvo Services

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Yajaman - I think the Volvo services are positioned with both objectives in mind - to add a profitable segment as also to offer an alternative to car /bike users to get them off the streets.

Why are Indiranagar & Koramangala not having sufficient Volvo services ? There are a few volvos passing on Indiranagar 80 ft road (due to Metro construction on CMH & 100 ft roads) as also some along Hosur rd (opposite Forum mall), but none on Koramangala 100-ft rd or 7th main (BDA complex rd) or along 80-ft peripheral & the other 80-ft rd perpendicular to it (the one in front of Police station & Raheja arcade). These can be potentially good catchment routes.

As you recommend, I have a suggestion for two possible routes :

1) From Byappanahalli along OMR, Indiranagar 80-ft &100 ft roads (this will avoid Metro construction site/s & Metro routes later), via Domlur & IRR & through KML peripheral 80-ft road, Sarjapur rd, road west of Agara kere, via HSR Layout (ORR) to join Hosur rd at Silkboard, then onwards to E-city along Hosur rd.

2) From Kadugodi via Kundalahalli on old Airport rd, turning into Lower Agaram rd & via KML 80-ft peripheral road (past passport office, NDDB), thence on KML 80-ft rd (past Police station), Kalyan mantap rd onto KML 100-ft rd to 7th Main (turn at BDA complex), thence onto Sarjapur rd, road west of Agara kere, HSR layout (ORR), Silkboard, Hosur rd & onwards to E-city.

These services will cover both Indiranagar & Koramangala well. Both routes will also go past the upcoming Koramangala TTMC. The 1st service will skim the eastern parts of Koramangala, whilst the 2nd one connects Austin town & Viveknagar also whilst slicing through inner parts of Koramangala. Also, there will be direct conncetivity between ITPL & E-city with Volvo services.

Mr.Murali - Yelli Iddira, as discussed with BMTC the other day is a must & SMS/s must be made chargeable to the commuter. Could you throw some light as to why this actually failed ? I have a feeling that the company that sposored itwere losing money since it was a free service & BMTC might have been tardy paying their bills (?). You would know better.

Yajaman /IDS - Enjoyed your non-volvo related exchanges - thanks for the entertainment !

kbsyed61's picture

Need some real time feedback on Volvo Service!

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I am sure lot of you are using Volvo service for your daily commute. I request all those who use or have used Volvo service to post your experiences here. That will definitely help Praja members to firm up their recommendation/suggestions to BMTC for corrective actions.

If you have any good suggestion to get this real time experiences, pls let Praja community know.

There was one suggestion to organize an Praja Style event "Day out with Volvo" to take the Volvo ride and share the experiences with Praja community. It seems to be a good idea, but need volunteers and a coordinator? Anybody game for this?

murali772's picture

Yi did not fail - it was dumped

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This comment has been moved here.

[off-topic comment, moved to a thread of its own - moderator]

Muralidhar Rao
Rithesh's picture

Swalpa good news

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I am told BMTC is in the process of digitizing all their routes (google/yahoo/xyz maps - not sure which one) - initially for the Volvo services and then for all other services. The time line is also not confirmed yet.

Once that is in place all the route rationalizing efforts by Praja will be simplified. Atleast a few of us will get a visual picture of the route rationalizing discussions here. I have been folowing the comments here - i am amazed at how some people know so many routes by heart.

In between all this - please more ideas on how to popularize Volvo services. I back Syed's idea.

Each one of us could take different Volvo routes (no going out of the way - just travel to your office uisng the Volvo service for a day or two), come back and post our feedback/suggestion - on things like timings, bottle necks in routes, usage, pricing, etc.

kbsyed61's picture

SB, you were bang on!

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SB,

You were bang on "...BMTC will do well to engage a professional agency to do a user need and traffic pattern survey on the routes it has identified to be profitable for Volvos.." 

BMTC definitely needs professional help whenever they take up route rationalization or redo their routes.

The traffic pattern study is not difficult to do, given the fact that there are limited destinations/origins where the majority of the daily commuters can be reached/surveyed.

Tthe ITPL, Electronic city, Peenya Industrial associations etc all can roped into to help with the study/survey and in fact their active help can be solicited for better placement of routes & schedules.

 

 

murali772's picture

Ritesh avare' How else do

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Ritesh avare'

How else do you suppose Yi worked? - through use of digitised maps only. And, these were available over three years back. So, what is BMTC re-inventing now?

And, as for feedback from commuters, how better can they be than at    http://bangalore.praja.in/blog/murali772/2009/04/09/yi-did-not-fail-it-was-dumped#comment-13233

Muralidhar Rao

Muralidhar Rao
kbsyed61's picture

Yajamanre, That doesn't mean!

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Yajamanre,

w.r.t your comment "We cannot please everyone staying in all parts of Bangalore with 225 or even 400 buses."

I don't think any body is clamoring for door-to-door service. We all know the reality about What is possible and what is NOT.

Why can't BMTC position the Volvo routes such that it touches main junctions or change over stations so that even the unfortunate ones (who doesn't live around direct routes) can at least has the option of change over.

Let me walk you through such places that exist in B'lore. J . C. Nagar (Munireddy Palya) is one such place. If I need to go to Electronic city, I don't think there is any direct route. One has to go to SBS and take the EC route. In most cases there is ample connectivity to shivajinagar from JC Nagar. But beyond SBS it becomes tricky and should be lucky to get a reliable route service. If BMTC can position the Volvos such that some of its routes touches SBS or nearby place, people can rely on for thier daily commute.

I think the challenge is to adjust the routes to connect the centers from where people can take the connecting service to reach their destination/Origin. In this case If volvo service can touch SBS or Shantinagar bus stations from Major Industrial centers in South B'lore (From ITPL, Whitefield, EC, Jiggani, Bommanhalli), it will be definetely be a popular service. Today there exists routes to these places. But problem is reliability, timings and frequency of the buses. I think that is the core issue that BMTC needs to address if they want to popularize the service.

Same story holds good for ITPL, Whitefield, Mahadevpura Industrial areas.

 

 

Srivatsava's picture

Let people know Volvos arent costly.

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     There are many routes that run on a mixed-fleet of ordinary buses, Suvarna, and Volvo. The BMTC has to first target its existing customers into the Volvo.

    On such mixed fleet routes, the BMTC should put up posters/ads that compare the rates of different services on a particular route. Similarly, on ordinary buses, the ads could compare the ticket prices (to different stops along the route) of ordinary buses and Suvarna, which may help drive some more people into Suvarna buses. Already, since there is a high acceptability for Survarna, why not put up posters comparing the prices of Suvarna and Volvo in these Suvarna buses.

-Srivatsava V

-Srivatsava V

Srivatsava's picture

Airline-like upgrades?

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These posters (as in above comment) may not attract pass-holders, so why not accept the pass-holders into the Volvo, by asking them to pay the differnce amount?

     So if point A to B is priced Rs8 on Suvarna and Rs12 on Volvo, I may not be interested to take a Volvo even if its the first bus I get after coming to the bus stop. So, to tempt me into the Volvo, why not allow me to pay the difference Rs4 (or charge a rupee extra for the 'upgrade') ad ttravel in the Volvo? Such a move will help reach out to a large number of peopleusing daily passes. Its a lot more easier to attractexisting bus users into Volvos and convincing car users to opt for buses.

    Such upgrades are not be difficult to implement, with the electronic ticketing units used in Volvos.

-Srivatsava V

-Srivatsava V

das's picture

Volvo - what is the long term game plan ?

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One thing I find deeply troubling is that the poorer ordinary bus user is subsidizing the richer Volvo user to a crazy extent.

 

Volvo

Ordinary

Capital cost

75 Lakhs

12 Lakhs

Fuel consumption

1.7 kmpl.

4.3 kmpl.

Fare

Rs. 25

Rs. 10

Capacity

35

75


Going by just the capital cost alone, the Volvo's fare must be at least 6 times that of the ordinary bus. When you consider the high running cost dues to high fuel consumption and maintenance costs, the low carrying capacity, and the low capacity utilization, the extent of subsidy is even higher.

Some questions that I hope BMTC has answers to:
1. What exactly is BMTC's game plan here ?
2. If the intent of the subsidy is to move the car and 2-wheeler users into buses, when will the subsidy end, and when it does end will the Volvo fare be 10-15 times that of the ordinary bus ?
3. The Volvo is serious overkill in terms of luxury. Isn't it time to stop buying these buses and opt for cheaper ones even for the luxury service ?
4. If BMTC agrees with point 3, why is it in the process of buying 200 more Volvos (if I got the figure right) ?




das's picture

Public transport - lopsided policy

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Here's a serious anomaly in our government's policy on public transport, notwithstanding the stress laid on it in the NUTP.

Out of the Volvo's cost of Rs. 75 Lakhs, taxes account for Rs. 24 Lakhs - one third. Public transport is not only not subsidized, but is on the contrary heavily taxed.

Private transport on the other hand gets heavy subsidies, like the  Nano which is subsidized to the extent of Rs. 50,000 according to Sunita Narain of the CSE. See this article. http://www.downtoearth.or...

Naveen's picture

Das - I think You Are Right

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I had not seen it from this angle earlier.

I understand that volvos cost abt 70 lakhs & ordinary buses, 15 lakhs. Even the chinese kinglong buses being used in Delhi & Mumbai (very small numbers) cost about 35 lakhs for ordinary & 50 lakhs for AC versions, but some reports state that these chinese buses lack the quality & pick-up of volvos.

Going by your calculations, it does indeed seem like the subsidy is heavily tilted in favor of AC bus users, unless ridership increases substantially. Thus, one would have to say that the operation of these buses must be confined only to carefully selected routes with higher patronage, else they will lose money heavily.

SB_YPR's picture

A few thoughts...

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Hi,

@ Srivathsa,

On such mixed fleet routes, the BMTC should put up posters/ads that compare the rates of different services on a particular route.

Excellent idea. Even stand-alone posters of the fares should help, since most commuters already know the fares of the ordinary Parisara Vahini buses. In fact, I spotted the fare-list of 201-R put up on a wall at the C.V. Raman Nagar bus stand. More such initiatives would go a long way in dispelling the myth of the Volvo as an outrageously expensive mode of transport - in most cases, it's cheaper and better than an auto.

@Das,

One thing I find deeply troubling is that the poorer ordinary bus user is subsidizing the richer Volvo user to a crazy extent.

One crucial correction in the stats you have mentioned. The Volvo's capacity is 70, not 35. Thus, any calculation made on the basis of the earlier figure must be slashed by half.

@Naveen,

Out of the Volvo's cost of Rs. 75 Lakhs, taxes account for Rs. 24 Lakhs - one third. Public transport is not only not subsidized, but is on the contrary heavily taxed.

That is stunning, to say the least. It should be public transport that is subsidised by private, not the other way round. Just forgoing the tax (or shifting it to Nano and other cars) will result in the Volvos becoming cheaper by a third - which will go a long way in improving profitability.

Sadly, BMTC's approach even to its Volvo users is lopsided - there are plenty of them around, and yet BMTC does not seem to care for all of them equally. Thanks to its warped approach, BMTC might just be running the risk of losing even its existing Volvo commuters. Read this to find out why.

Regards,

~~~~

Manish, Nagarbhavi.

~~~~

Manish.

das's picture

Clarifications

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@Naveen,

The costs of various buses are:
Vajra (Volvo) : 75 Lakhs
Suvarna : 16 Lakhs
Ordinary : 12 Lakhs

@Manish,
I don't think the Vajras carry 70 people, but even assuming that they do, there's still the issue of 6 times the capital cost, 2 times the fuel consumption, and definitely higher maintenance costs. For the same level of profitability I'm sure the fare should be at least 10 times higher than the ordinary bus. KG Stand - JP Nagar that now costs Rs. 25 in the Vajra should cost Rs. 100. Which sounds reasonable - I think the First class fare in Mumbai's local trains IS 10 times the normal fare.

The Volvos are I think seriously over-designed for Bangalore, in terms of both power and luxury. In all fairness to BMTC, they were probably the only option available before the Marco Polo came along. The latter costs 55 Lakhs, but the technical and user feedback on it does not seem to be good.

If a few city transport firms get together and negotiate with Volvo, I'm sure they'll have enough clout to get Volvo to come up with a much cheaper model of a 'Developing country luxury intra-city bus'. Lower engine HP, lower fuel consumption, lower luxury, lower maintenance costs, etc. Maybe call it a Volvo Nano :)

Naveen's picture

The Fare-Quality Nexus

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I think an earlier post that I had made is relevant here. Hence, I am reproducing it verbatim below :

Unlike international practices, public transport, mainly bus services in India being a low-income country, have generally been governed by low fares at low levels of service. One type of low-quality service was acceptable to all then & even now, except for the better off cities (such as Bangalore, Mumbai & Delhi), public transport is generally based on these principles.

As a result, there had been leakages – keeping fares low to assist poor travelers & low-income groups involves a leakage of benefits to better off passengers. The lower the fare, for a given level of service, the higher is the leakage. Conversely, for a given fare, increasing the level of service will also increase leakage. Most public bus operators in the country are thus, deep in the red, with increasing subsidies.

BMTC though, since bifurcation from KSRTC has been managing without subsidies, & with low pilferage of revenues. The low fare /low level of service had been producing a flight to 2-wheelers & cars. This in turn had produced a very heavy load on the road system. BMTC’s network continues to be diffuse & tries to connect the maximum number of origins & destinations to limit transfers to just one – SBS or Shivajinagar or KR Market (implying low frequency of service on individual routes).

The fare /quality issue has finally begun to be tackled – BMTC has introduced differentiated services (Volvo Vajras & lately, Suvarna skip-stop services with reserved seats /without over-crowding) to try to capture the quality-seeking passengers, with higher service /quality levels at higher fares.

But, is it too little too late ? The flight to private vehicles continues unabated & might intensify if the current pace of motorization is not halted & restraining measures are not pushed into place.

No matter how excellent the supply side of public bus transport is, the service will only have as much quality as the traffic conditions allow. The city does not seem to want to introduce public bus transport priority measures on city roads, & appears to be pinning it’s hopes on the Metro-rail, still several years away, & with limited coverage. The consequences of this approach might be negative for both, road-based bus operations & the Metro-rail. A low-cost, effective option is thus being neglected & only other expensive ones, like Metro /LRT /Mono remain on the table. At the very least, this means that fewer corridors can be provided with prioritized public transport modes.

praja.in/bangalore/blog/naveen/2008/05/01/public-bus-transport-%E2%80%93-the-fare-quality-nexus

silkboard's picture

Eye-opening stats and debates

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After eye-opening stats and mostly constructive debates, I think its time to organize a meeting with BMTC where we pass on the suggestions (in the spirit of positivity) that have come up in various threads, plus, ask them these (above raised by asj, das etc) valid questions as well:

  • Long term game plan with Volvos/differential services. Clarify on operating numbers and business plan for differential services. There may be things we don't know, or the least, let us hear them out once.

We will have to do this meeting in moderated fashion where we hear their side, and even if some things we hear don't make sense, we'd just use the meeting to get their viewpoint and thinking. Let us come back from that meeting, and then go full hog on constructive criticism. But doing "this is not right that is not right" in the meeting itself will not be good use of engagement time.

There is no such thing as consensus in public life. engagements will have suggestions as well as a few hard questions. But on our part, let us promise to be mature and moderated in the meeting, we will hear them out on the suggestions and questions, and take it from there.

I sincerely hope that BMTC will be game for such a meeting. BMTC, whether some of us criticize you, or defend you, we are mostly your friends and well wishers here.

Naveen's picture

BMTC Meeting Called For

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I agree that a meeting with BMTC is required. Das's analysis is quite revealing & expensive volvo services on certain non-productive segments (such as Hop-On/Off) is indeed questionable.

It appears that there is diversion of profits from ordinary operations as also other revenue streams to keep these volvos running. The answer is to cut the flab & operate services where they cover their own costs, nothing more.

Rithesh's picture

Bus cost - more accurate figures needed

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Looked at the BMTC tenders of the last few months.

There are two tender which give some sort of estimate on the cost of the buses

1. Procurement of New Fully built Buses-EURO III, Airconditoned, Semilowfloor, Rearengine (BMTC/2008/052)
No of units - 5
Estimated cost - 3,00,00,000

2. Procurement of New Fully built Buses, city type, single deck, BS III under Jnnurm (BMTC/2009/015)
No of units - 89
Estimated cost - 18,00,00,000


The first one refers to Volvo buses (I am not aware of any other AC buses BMTC uses) and the second one refers to Suvarna buses - city type. Going by these details the approximate cost of
Volvo buses is 60,00,000
Suvarna buses is 21,00,000

In any case as Das pointed out Volvo services seam to be subsidized - we need to find the exact cost of these buses from BMTC.

Taxes on the buses are really not an issues since they are collected by the state government and the state government inturn reimburses some amount every year to BMTC (last year it was 110 crores).

But certainly the taxes on private vehicles should be increased from their current levels.

idontspam's picture

Bus priority lanes a priority

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I believe the bus cost is a diversionary conversation which doesnt solve the purpose of providing timely bus services. You solve nothing by focusing on the type of bus. I would encourage taking up the cause of priority bus lanes instead which will lead to something fruitful. You may be able to convince the BMTC and BBMP to hasten the process and try out bus lanes the Big 10 corridor which anyway has been suggested in ABIDe report.

kbsyed61's picture

Lets get the basic Facts from official sources!

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Meeting with BMTC

I don't think meeting with BMTC will be a problem. But the real question is what is the end objective of that exercise? What will be the end result of that engagement? I think before we embark on setting up a meeting, we should do some basic home work prior to the meeting. We should get some basic facts out first. Some is available thru their website and in their annual admin report  "http://www.bmtcinfo.com/english/Reports/Final_English.PDF". For rest of them, thru RTI. Lets do that first. Once you have substantial facts on hand, having a formal meeting with BMTC would make sense and steps thereafter. Up to now all facts are collated from non-official sources.

Fare Structure and Basis.

In India the fare structure in public transport system is not a function of "Return of Investment" i.e actual cost of the service, profit margin etc. It is true for all the Public Transport system including Railways. Even fare structure in metro is also not a function of actual cost. We have heard from railways that they simply can not have higher fare for city commuter service.

Need a paradigm shift

In order to make them a function of actual cost and also keep it low, it needs a paradigm shift in the whole costing of the operations of PT system. PTs should have lower cost on all their operations, purchases and administration. That calls for lower cost of the services and purchases for the PTs. Basically there should be tax exemption for all the services and material purchased by PTs. In US, even registered Non-profit Organization gets tax exemption even in grocery stores.

Naveen, I remember you asked a question on how to make subsidies work for PTs not for private vehicles. A crude way of doing this is making the fuel available at the actual cost+taxes+surcharges for everybody, except for PT usage. PTs should only pay for the cost. It really needs a sophisticated system which makes pilferage impossible.

 

 

skumaras's picture

Price comparison of Volvo vs Ordinary buses

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@Das,
I am not sure where you got the numbers for doing the comparison between the Volvos and ordinary buses, particularly regarding the Capital cost and Fuel consumption. The numbers for fuel consumption for Volvos I have seen in some websites is around 2.5 kmpl. Also 12 lakhs seems to be too low for a regular bus. My understanding is that an Ashok Leyland bus chassis itself costs upwards of 16 lakhs and if you add the cost of the body it would bring the cost closer to 20 lakhs.

By the way private operators who provide long distance intercity services are able to run their Volvo services profitably just by charging a 30% to 40 % premium over their regular non A/C buses with just the air-suspension. These private operators have no reason to subsidize their Volvo operations from their regular operations, and the ticket prices should reflect their operating costs. This leads me to believe that the capital cost is just one part of the cost of running these buses. There are other significant costs such as cost of fuel, salaries of staff, maintenance etc. From a total cost of operation, the Volvos do not appear to be more than 50% more expensive compared to ordinary buses, by looking at the ticket prices at least for long distance operations. 

If the above comparison holds true for the intra-city low floor Volvos also, BMTC should be able to run a profitable service even at the current ticket rates.

 


Rithesh's picture

Bus priority lanes - BMLTA needed

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We raised this issue in the previous meeting with BMTC. They wash their hands claiming that BBMP/BDA and BTP should do this. If you talk individually to these agencies they will pass on the blame to other agencies. Each of these agencies in their individual capacity either have the will to implement this nor have do they have the expertise.

The need of the hour BMLTA.

Everyone one wants status quo on BMLTA because if that comes into force, the current agencies will loose their current powers -
BDA/BBMP will no longer be able to take decisions on road designs/flyovers/underpasses.
BMTC will not be responsible for bus routing.
BTP will not be responsible for traffic flow planning.
etc, etc.,

Pubic pressure on the govt is needed for this. A dummy organization is in place because of the JNNURM requirements, but the BMLTA act is yet to be formulated - till date only Hyderabad has gone ahead and passed the LTA act.

Naveen's picture

BMLTA Needed - I agree

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I think Rithesh has said what we had all been thinking for quite some time now. Perhaps it may be a good idea to pursue the PIL previously thought of  ( praja.in/gyan/draft-pil ).

It may not be sufficient to just make BMLTA the umbrella authority. Through the PIL, we will also have to push for the institution to have staff with sufficient know-how & capability & eventually build capacity to make recommendations to other entities & regulate various PT issues & infratsructure development, such as BRT.

Further, I think we need to include the point about PTs being given tax exemptions & benefits since they are an important social service sector. This of course may involve further discussions & expert opinion from lawyer/s.

idontspam's picture

BBMP/BCP

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They wash their hands claiming that BBMP/BDA and BTP should do this

I can understand, BMTC dont even own bus stops let alone roads. We should raise this with Praveen Sood and check how to proceed. If this needs BBMP involvement we may need to have a meeting with them too. If none from Praja is going to be at the BCIC Open house on Apr 16th maybe Devesh can check these items for us. (bus priority lanes & Commercial street ped)

s_yajaman's picture

@ Syed - response to the rest of my comment?

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Syed,

Could you read the rest of my comment and see if it makes sense.  My point was that BMTC is spreading its Volvo resources way too thin across to many routes.

Srivathsa

Drive safe.  It is not just the car maker which can recall its product.

silkboard's picture

Numbers from Das

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While the point Das is trying to make is valid, stats provided may not be accurate. skumaras already pointed to this above.

First of all, purchase cost numbers and milage itself may not be right.

Next, one time purchase cost is one thing, total cost of ownership (TCO) over the period of bus'es life is the real deal. Purchase prices may include some warranty and maintenance. You may be paying some premium for better quality.

On fares, we all have seen that even private players charge less than double the regular bus fare for their Volvo services.

While the point being made by many is valid - we need to understand the business case for differentiated service, some aspects of Volvo/Marco polo may be overkill (most of us agree on A/c being that, but better ride quality and better acceleration are not) - at the same time, let us be careful when blessing any numbers. Lets get the numbers from the source itself :)

Syed - ideally, the goal of our engagement with BMTC should be to promote a culture of transparency and public-feedback. At this point, we should not set any hard targets here (like - we will make the buy or sell their Volvos, or we will get 10 new routes added on some roads).

I would be happy if us, as a group, get lots of stats and details of decision making process from BMTC out in the public domain. That will be an acheivement which will enable us or any other enthusiast groups to do more in future.

To BMTC once again, we are your true friends. True friends give real feedback, some good, some negative, all with the hopes of improving you.

Vasanthkumar sir - patience please. Can't expect BMTC to come read al the comments, not yet. Thats why we have to take extra step of meeting them , regularly, to pass over all we have heard and learned here or anywhere else.

das's picture

Sources of my data

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@skumaras,

The technical numbers are from the BMTC web site, Volvo site, etc. The costs are from a senior BMTC officer.

Fuel consumption

A press article mentioned that the Vayu Vajra has an average fuel consumption of 2.73 kmpl.

I read that the average for the Volvos in the city is 1.7 kmpl. Remember that the Vayu Vajras mostly run on the highway. The difference between highway and city consumption is typically 25 %, so this is reasonable.

Cost of buses
The cost data is from the BMTC itself, from a personal conversation.

Ultimately, the BMTC is the best judge of their profitability. Even if they are not profitable but the BMTC's long term plan takes care of this, there's no issue here. Sort of like airline companies charging low rates and running at a loss for a couple of years to increase load factor.

ashwin's picture

Route Suggestion: Volvo to Embassy Golf Links (Inner Ring Road)

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We have Volvos plying to E-City, ITPL and Bagmane Tech Park (CV Raman Nagar). The only large Tech Park not covered is Embassy Golf Links, behind the DELL office, on inner ring road. There is a 201-R that plies on the inner ring road, but I think a route going into the complex would get more riders. There are, by my estimate upwards of 15,000 people working in this complex.

A possible route would be from Koramangala to Indira Nagar, via EGL, as these are the two localities where a large number of people working here stay.
s_yajaman's picture

Any progress on this? BMTC Volvo

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This thread seems to have gone into hiding!  Any updates on this?  When do we meet BMTC next?  What are the next steps?

Srivathsa

Drive safe.  It is not just the car maker which can recall its product.

kbsyed61's picture

Next Step - To do a Survey!

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Yajamanre,

 The next step would be to do a survey (both Online & Paper based). The draft questions are posted on another thread along with the actual survey form. Feel free to comment and suggest additional questions.

http://praja.in/blog/kbsyed61/2009/04/24/bmtc-survey-questions-draft-review

binaiks's picture

Nothing ever changes

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Be it a premium service or the common man's service, the attitude of BMTC staff is the same. Buses never operate on time and is hardly a medium that one can depend on for their daily travel.

BMTC on itself claims that the revenue it earns from the Bannerghatta Road service is almost equal to what it earns on its IT sector routes (Electronic City/ITPL). However, the service on this road leaves a lot to be desired. There remains of gap of about 45 minutes between buses during peak hours, and one can see buses one-behind-the-other during noon hours. 

BMTC website claims that the route (V365) had 12 buses on it. The frequency on this leaves a LOT to be desired. 

BMTC introduced two more Volvo service on the Bannerghatta Road route - but were designed as if they wanted it to fail. The first is V368 - the first bus leaves from BN Park at 0930, and the last bus from Shivaji Nagar at 1630!!! Which office goer is being targeted by this service? The frequency - one approximately every hour (there are/were only two buses). 

The other is 411K - BN Park to ITPL. The first bus from BNP at 1230 and last at 1630! Do office goers travel at this hour???

It is evident from the timing itself that the corporation wanted the services to fail and not succeed.

When is BMTC changing its attitude?

See my blog for one of my very bad experiences in a BMTC Volvo. I continue using their services since I am major fan of public transport despite all its ills. But I am very confident that BMTC would scare me away from Public Transport very soon.

--
Thanks,
Binai Sankar
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Switch to Public Transportation, Save your city
--
Thanks,
Binai Sankar
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Switch to Public Transportation, Save your city
gbhupesh's picture

500P Volvo from Marathalli to Hebbal is poor planning

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74 users have liked.

We already have 500D running from Silk Board Jn. to Hebbel, which mostly get empty by the time Marathalli comes, as lot of people working in Cisco, Prestige tech Park etc get down by that time.


I feel there is no need to start this bus; rather they should increase frequency of 500D especially in evening. It is very difficult to get Volvo bus in evening while coming from Manyata Tech Park ( Nagawara) after 6PM. Frequency in evening is very less and because of traffic jam in evening  these buses rarely come on time.

ajigaa's picture

Gold monthly pass for Vayu Vajra ?

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84 users have liked.

May i know whether the Gold pass holder is allowed to travel in Vayu Vajra till Hebbal or Yelahanka

ndevi's picture

Volvo Bus service for K R Puram

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86 users have liked.

Hello Sir/Madam,

No volvo Buses are running from Mejestic to Tin Factory or Tin Factory to Mejestic. It will he helpful if u do the needful

 

Regards

Anithasunil's picture

319C comes to KRpuram. BMTC

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90 users have liked.

319C comes to KRpuram. BMTC had stopped the service some time back.. But, they seem to have started it again.. Recently, I found 319C a few times on the road..

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