Footpaths upgraded but width reduced

Photoyogi Yavare,

Nice pictures. I'm not sure if there are heights specified anywhere, but I think if the kerbside sidewalk is 8" higher than street level , it should be enough to discourage vehicles from trying to mount their wheels over the footpath, whilst at the same time, enable old people & children to step on to it.

One other thing is that this height must be maintained evenly across, even in way of entries /exits to gates. The rise from street level & also to gate could be made gradual /slanted. This will not interrupt the pedestrian walkway, & at the same time, permit a vehicle to rise on to the sidewalk height & then descend to the gate.

However, such designing (as is common overseas) can be misused as cars will use the gate approaches to "mount" their cars, one side up on to the footpaths.

Day after day I keep seeing more bad news. Why on earth narrow the width?
And when you start talking of IRC norms, they treat these documents with the same attitude that one has to a paper napkin when blowing noses (worse still - they would rather use these as toilet tissue).

ASJ

Forget IRC they dont adhere to even common sense. ACP Praveen Sood also admitted to similar sentiments when we met him. IRC overhauling was where we started the whole traffic engineering story on this site. Then I discovered apart from just being a reference book it is not enforced anywhere. BBMP doesnt get it. They probably dont even have a copy to use it as Toilet paper. I dont know how we should get it across to them. Its a different matter all the material in IRC needs overhauling.

What next? Expansion of once quite Serpentine Road? God, i so even dread that horror of seeing trees go on Serpentine Road! It is such as calm place and i still have fresh memories of my college life in Seshadripuram and pigging out at Gullu's chat and enjoying my hero cycle on Serpentine road!

Hi! Its subject to interpretation and its unhelpful (the guidance on height).

I suggest -

1. You fight hard to get back the original width as there should have been good grounds for reducing the width, there ought to have been public consultation and the IRC does say very clearly about the width 1.5m and more depending on other factors.
2. The height - you and others locally (more the better) should put up a strong argument against the lame duck reason provided thus far. Footpaths are for people of all abilities, abuse of footpaths is a matter of policing/law enforcement and can't be a reason for use of methods which will detract pedestrians from using the footpaths.
3. Demand there are dropped kerbs with non-slip tiles and appropriate gradients 
4. Opposite driveways / side lanes - get them to enhahnce the footpath (see images below).  

Here is another good link worth looking at http://www.cleanairnet.org/caiasia/1412/articles-72580_resource_1.pdf



Above are two options, I prefer the bottom one - its perfect for pedestrians, it doubles up as a gentle speed hump at points where vehicles ought to give way to those on main road.

Height in UK is no more than 6 inches. Lots of advantages of this - walkable as well as when buses angle in to stop parallel and close to the footpaths their left front corner routinely needs passing over the footpath to do this manoeuvre with success - a height any greater will stop them from doing this and either their buses will get damaged or they end up stopping away from footpaths.

ASJ

Hope this helps -

http://infrastructure.gov.in/pdf/four_lane.pdf See page 169 where this documents says 200mm (8 inches)

This is almost half of 31-16 inches theya are putting up now.

ASJ

Photoyogi,

Those pictures may look extremely good, however, remember that we have to use it only as reference information to come up with solutions suitable for our needs, & not copy them since they may be the norms elsewhere that might have proven successful.

With current levels of galloping motorization, poor public transport & widespread indiscipline by people of all types, we need to find methods by which rampant misuse by vehicles is under strict control & clearly, the traffic police cannot monitor each part of the city's side roads & secondary roads when monitoring the main thoroughfares itself is a formidable task.

Outdated IRC norms & recommendations on one side & international practices on another - we have to strike a balance somehow.

Under the circumstances, what I have seen in some parts of the city may work well - I have seen this off Lavelle road or Cubbon rd, where one finds a lot of small roads that have been made exclusive with barricades & a security guard posted at the barricade, who will only permit legitimate & bonafide traffic, after due verification. Thus, stray motor vehicle access to residential enclaves, purely for parking is controlled by the RWA & they become, in a way responsible for security within the area as well.

If sidewalks are planned with easy access to motor vehicle parking over them, such as the designs in those pictures, it will end up being an almost impossible task to chase away parked vehicles each day & each passing minute, though some may argue that it is being practiced in the west, so why not in India.

So, based on all this information, I think you should present your case to the Ch.Engr.

 

The images are great BUT.........

I have said this elsewhere, say it again -

Was there ever a good time for people like Jyotiba Phule to fight for women's education?
Was there ever a perfect time for fight against untouchability that Gandhi started?
Did our freedom fighters find a Muhurat for their struggle?
Can we fight HIV by keeping hush about sexual practices?
Is it possible to stop teenage pregnancies by not offering sex education in schools?

As a psychiatrist I deal with stigma with mental illness. Its prevailing even in West, patients say can you take the words Mental Health Unit out of the Banner on your building - we say NO. You can't fight stigma by shying away from it.

Can we fight terrorism by staying at home?

Can we stop anti-sociality on our streets by not providing the right facilities to pedestrians because we are scared they will be abused even more?

Ignoring best practice - is a formula of wait and watch for the right time.........I am afraid that time will never come. Its like saying driver habits will change over tme - but how much more time? When will we see the signage and road markings, when will we see the reforms in licensing? Who is working on it? What is the budget for these things?

What will work better is to provide the right facilities and for local communities to protect them. Why is there not a public out-cry over the action of narrowing footpaths?

What will work better is to implement the correct infrastructure and ask the Police to do their job. Ask them to entertain every image of a violator that common people can send to them (a phenomenon called citizens arrest). Why are people driving on wrong side of the road allowed to drive at all? Why are their licenses not being revoked?

Ask these questions, fight for the right things and for goodness sake let us stop running away from the fear of antisocials in our society - they have had a free run for a long time. 

ASJ

IDS,
I agree. Its time to raise the stakes and NOT accept lame duck excuses that people will park on footpath hence height has to be 16 inches.

I have a picture of a guy on a motorbike on wrong side of the road, on a footpath with rails and though height of footpath is not fully appreciated it was very similar to what we are seeing above.

Did it stop this guy from breaking the rules?

Only one thing will stop this anti-sociality - law enforcement. Period.

ASJ

Photoyogi,

Good job. Is it possible to give the contact detail of the BBMP engineer, Mr Gowda ?

I would like to talk to him to get his perspective on why the road designs are the way they are and how we can improve the process.

Suhas

Congrats on making an organization like BBMP listen and take notice. Hopefully you have found somebody who may start the change we want to see. Good luck!

All, One more thing we need to do in this battle is to have the chief engineers office send out a DO letter(department order letter) to all sub divisions to follow this example and not make the same mistake. I can bet, this is happening in many areas and it will be easier for people to approach local BBMP office if the chief engineer has a official order on this.. Regards Anjan

If you observe Sampige Road in Malleswaram now, it has yellow road end lines on either side (i think). Serpentine Road should have similar simple infrastructure. Also parking spots have to marked on either side of the road since the road is not a main corridor.

Hapazard parking causes loss of valuable parking space. Properly marked parking will make parking better and easier.

PY,

Great going.  Goes to show the impact just 2 or 3 interested people can make.  A good RWA and some perseverance go a long way.

Srivathsa

@Photoyogi I'm very interested in knowing from you if you succeed in trying to revert the footpaths height (and width as well) back to what is documented and approved. I tried finding out on your blog but I ain't find anything related to it.

Thanks!