so many drinking water woes with the Monsoon in full swing and people having empty taps now when there is more water, talk about mess-ups again
deadlines missed, monies stopped does it sound any different than before? Yes it does!
Incapacity and incompetency of the pumped up private sector in this case and also of the bureaucrats who showed them the way. But you can't take an intelligent citizenry in Mysore for a ride and that is what JNNURM , PPPs and the private sector tried to do in Mysore even with 40,000 public having signed against giving the project to JUSCO.
and now the reports elsewhere (star of mysore) is that it will cost 25 % more = 50 crs in the IInd year itself with noone having got any 24 X7 supply
thereby hangs a tale of last mile service delivery?
===========================================
Water distribution adds to JUSCO's troubles
The civic body, which is nodal agency for the implementation of JNNURM projects, has clearly told JUSCO that it is not satisfied with its work and has stopped payment of bills. It has also overshot its committed deadline to supply water 24X7 to some of the areas to start with. "I've told the JUSCO MD when he was here sometime back that their activities are not up to the mark," corporation commissioner K S Raykar on Tuesday explained to angry corporators who assailed the MCC for its handling of the water services.
Ironic as it is, the civic body spent over two hours discussing lax water supply when monsoon is peaking. What is worse is that the city is getting the quantity of water it requires but the taps are going dry in many areas after a couple of hours, which dominated the proceedings at the council meeting.
Members cutting across party lines complained against JUSCO seeking remedial actions from mayor Sandesh Swamy. He has now set a one-month deadline to study and address the water woes. "In case of failure, action will be imminent," he stated.
When complaints flowed at the house, Raykar was sought to explain. "There are complaints against JUSCO and we have discussed it with them. Their operations and maintenance is not to the expectations. I've conveyed this in no uncertain terms in a letter to the JUSCO. This was discussed when its MD was here too. They were required to provide water 24X7 as per the agreement from April but they have overshot it. The MCC has stopped payment of bills for such lapses," he stated.
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Facts?
with 40,000 public having signed against it
Please enlighten us on the following before you can expect to have a fact based discussion on this as most people will not know the following
1. What is the total available water at source stations in MLD before and after the private party started O&M, over comparable YoY period? Official figures please.
2. How many hours a day + total MLD supply of water do the citizens get over how much they were recieving before private O&M? Official figures please.
3. How many meters(numbers) have been installed for existing connections and how much in rupee terms the collection has improved since the private operator took over O&M?Official numbers please.
pl answer
@ IDS since you are so fact based
Mr R Purohit or the website of JUSCO for Mysore could answer some of these
But I do feel that this is about last mile service by JUSCO
Allegations & supporting data
Mr R Purohit or the website of JUSCO for Mysore could answer some of these
Since you dont have access to any numbers to support your allegations, I can gather they are the ones making these accusations then?
media reports on JUSCO and 24 X 7 services
These are media reports in Star of Mysore and Times of India on 2 days this week
I am not the reporter so am not making allegations the verification is left only to those who feel the people have a voice.
Not surprising
SO many of the concerned public who welcomed JUSCO last year
what do they say about the missed deadlines here
next one is october which they might keep up, even if they have failed many of their own already
Easy, penalize or fire them!
Its simple. Not meeting deadlines? Check what SLA they signed up for. If not meeting, penalize them as per the contract, or fire them!
Nobody is married to JUSCO here. We are only married to the idea of outsourcing as a way to enable you and me (via our companies) to help government in providing us better services, thats all.
To go back to JUSCO deadline. if you find that the contract with JUSCO doesn't include penalties for not meeting SLAs or deadlines, force MCC/MUDA to renegotiate the contract. Everybody will be with you on that. Because such things were not even possible on the previous in-sourced arrangement.
But have you read the contract? Aware of penalty clasues? Gave your input to the contract negotiating team at MCC/MUDA at the time? Probably not. But its not late even now. Go do it for us please. Squeeze JUSCO, and get us better services.
How about empty taps in Bangalore?
Why no such anger for BWSSB? No water in most taps for a week here, and not one war cry from you or any one from the anti-JUSCO clan?
Don't worry, I have read the contract Bangaore have with BWSSB, because there is none! Are there any penalties for BWSSB for failing to meet its SLA (which is water on alternate days)? Oh O, forget the penalties sir, there is no SLA in the first place with its own consumers :) Wonder whether we are consumers, or beggars (for water) in this progressive city.
apparently yes
OK so lets see what else is not happening last mile here
We ran out of good quality SAND some years back, which led to sand mining and sand washing and bad quality like maybe in the Shantiniketan case
We ran out of jelly and chhapadi kallu so now all the old chappadi kallus are being converted to jelly kallu for foundations cement concrete etc etcetra
road surface is increasing for the world class city we now live in so in this apparently world class city but with uncontrolled water extraction and consumption is it a surprise we ran out of water, so the richest top quintile in Far east Bangalore face the same problem which the core area urban poor and slum dwellers faced for the longest time, wow what an equaliser.......
the Minsiter saying that no more water can be given is a statement of remarkable Courage but borewells are being sunk instead.....and only in the wards where there are BJP{ corporators apparently
What will change even if we get the next few 100 MLDs from Cauvery in end 2011
welcome to the dying city concrete above and below us and all around us
abandoning city?
the Minsiter saying that no more water can be given
All along, you have been clamouring for rule by elected representatives only, and refusing to even recognise (forget engage with) advisers duly appointed by the Chief Minister. So, now that you have them, why are you condemning them also?
welcome to the dying city
So, are you suggesting abandoning the city? May be, you should give the lead.
problem talk
Public Agenda - good analysis on how we are running dry.
Very good talk of the problem. So what next? Where else to get the other 100 MLD from? And how to make sure that the 200 MLD (100 from cauvery, 100 from conservation recycling etc) will be distributed fair and even.
Ideas please, not ideology.
share the growth model
So then give an idea whether you share this grwoth and bust model or limt the role of stakeholders who will pick up and leave when this city goes bust and hawk their Growth model elsewhere
is it not possible to go al the way the Arabian sea near mangalore and then lets set up a water desal plant (maybe in the 75000 acre SEZ) like the two in Chennai and pipe the water back (after laying another line) like the petro and oil line
and then lets do even more and go all the way to teh arctic and get some ice floes which are melting anyway
and when they find out that there are not only water crystals but also water on Mars lets get some to the IT silicon city
dead or dying lets kill the rest of the solar system why only Mars while we are at it
Population growth model
this grwoth and bust model
What growth model? Population needs water wherever they are. Its not like the same set of people started drinking more water. There are either more people or less water. The net water requirement for a given set is not changing only the locations are. The only growth model that needs changing is stop having kids by the dozen. I will support your campaign for a 'reduce population' campaign.
I am really lost now
Was that sarcastic? Not sure. Why do you and some others get upset when talking solutions? There are n reasons to derail solution talk, let me list some
But please, share your ideas on the solutions, or what needs to be done. Just for once, try to de-clutter and de-mix from those n other things and talk proposals, not just oppo-sals..
Educate others, share the wealth of knowledge you carry. I don't know all the solutions to shortage, that is the only reason I am pleading you here!
And yeah, I am Pranav, live in Whitefield, male, married. Go by silkboard just for fun. How about yourself?
@ IDS Oh our Ideal world. Whos messing up?
In a Utopia no resource will ever run out
But in the growth Model there are huge number of extra last mile resources exhausting a whole lot of others. If JLL, Cushman and Wakefield, and the Falcon counting only a few talk about the "sustainable" growth of the RE sector does it mean 7,8.9 or 10 % at 200-300% profit. am sure you culd see that growth model
Does luxury housing not lie empty overstocked during the entire recession and now new Villa projects of Rs 40 crs are being marketed... near whitelifed
Do enternatinment / recreation/ multiplex and retail have a growth model ? a buisness model and a buisness plan? Do mobile cos have one? and if this game is played out in a city does that not affect growth with a resource premium
obviously a market does not deicde since the biggest market shortage and backlog is in EWS / LIG housing viz., 99% of 26 million (LAST MILE) houses in the country do you think the backlog is due to the lack of an appropriate growth model
Ideology & water
Does luxury housing not lie empty overstocked during the entire recession and now new Villa projects of Rs 40 crs are being marketed... near whitelifed
...and because those flats are lying empty we are not getting water? Wow.. what logic!!!
do a class again ?
while explaing the growth model and last mile resource consumption mentioned overstocking of luxury housing which requires huge amount of water not only for the huge need of concrete but also the pressure washing of marble, granite etc etc millions of liters from our common resouce which is a basic need for people to keep alive
even a space
is keeping such a reource intensive product like luxury housing unsold for years (while 99% of the need is for cheap yet quality housing) even when there is a limited Ground water availability OK?
maybe we need to do a class for educated, english literate, about the responsibilty of this growth model and its share in the boom and bust of great cities
All this is also creating a certain kind of scarcity COMMON SENSE
and a certain kind of city IVORY TOWERS like landmark or shantiniketan OR Villas for the rich or some estates product while the unequal urban poor are being ousetd by the very same growth model and made homeless again.
More housing, less agriculture
overstocking of luxury housing which requires huge amount of water not only for the huge need of concrete but also the pressure washing of marble, granite etc etc
So you recommend we move to caves because it conserves water? Nice going. By the same logic since we are doing less agriculture shouldnt we have more water?
Do you know how many liters of drinking water does a cheap housing need vs a costly housing need? Can you share those figures?
a buisness model and a buisness plan? Do mobile cos have one?
So mobile companies are reason for being able to source more water?
@IDS & @Murali772 You Get it now ??? YAAAY!
in prehistory when there was no concrete there was a roof over the head
BUT NO PIPED water and so the GRAND EQUATION is that those RE sector ppl who overbuilt and overstocked and kept unsold will now NOT GET AN NOC
so no piped water for a year and half from BWSSB thats almost equal to the caves a roof over the head and no piped water
hopefully cool the moulding grwoth model too
downside is the ppl laughing all the way to the ultimate bankruptcy (running out of good ground water) are the borewell owners
so NOW was that SO DIFFICULT?
Neanderthalism
so NOW was that SO DIFFICULT?
Absolutely not, I wish you good luck in moving all of Bangalore to caves. Along the way we can give up electricity, buy more donkeys, move to barter system... may be start growing fins and move back to water.
alright signing off
Yet another promising discussion lost to useless ideology talk. PAgenda sir - knowledge and promis you hold, I am still hopeful will show up for something productive, which in my books is talking data and solutions on the specific issues.
EWS, rich poor, market, welfare etc are absolutely meaningless debates to me. Thats like breathing air, we all know its there, but doesn't fill stomach when I am hungry. Really tired of those, whether you do it, or Murali/IDS does it.
Bye.
here's a lead
May be this will help figure out where all the water goes, of course, in addition to the over-stocked luxury housing
wow thats a new ism
shd we put a new ideology on wikipedia. it might help if other than IDS ppl would also join in in th 21st century, but the rider is that preshistory did not have isms only they also had no piped water supply
Weird & Off-Track
Been going thro this thread weaving it's way all around the world & getting nowhere.
PA Sir - would appreciate you stick to where you started - that you supposed people had a complaint against JUSCO & the alleged unsatisfactory water situation created.
Instead, we have gone round & around & ended up no place in the middle of nowhere !
unending debate leading to nowhere.....
Why is this 'dogfight' going on and on? What started as a promising debate by all concerned has strayed into 'tu tu mein mein....'.Please, hold your horses gentlemen!