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HAL: invest before re-opening?

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AviationPublic Transport

Just for a moment, forget those debates around whether HAL should re-open or not. Lets say a re-opening is coming (via court order, govt forcing its will, or whatever). Then, in the Praja spirit of positivity and high expectations(!), what would be the best ways of re-opening and operating this airport?

For starters, it better be a long term plan, with investments to upgrade the facilities and infrastructure around the airport. Keeping it open for just 3 years will lead to the same old story. Citing planned closure as a reason, AAI or anyone will not invest any serious money. The planned-closure, according to AAI, was the reason they couldn't invest big on the airport over last 3-4 years.

Now, here is this wild idea. What if we re-open HAL as the first pure-public-transport, or zero-parking airport in the world!? Since space is at a premium in this area, we wouldn't have any structures to facilitate parking of cars or cabs. What would that be like? Here are some pictures to dream of this possibility:

First up, you would have to make the arrival and departure roads to HAL airport as one ways. That will ensure that big buses can come all the way to the terminal building (PTB).

Apparently, one reason BMTC couldn't run buses till HAL because there wasn't enough space for the buses to move around near PTB. One way approach and exit roads solve some of that. I hear that AAI wants the Indian Oil depot to go away (remember, this has been called out as a safety concern, too close to PTB). With that thing gone, you have a big enough area to work with.

Areas A and B would be available as public transport (Vaayu Vajra, Park and ride shuttles, Hotel shuttles) pick up and drop off points. Area C (which might be available as HAL bus depot is no longer in use now) could be developed as a the nearest park and ride point. Come park your car, take a shuttle or walk to the airport. Private parties could be encouraged to build more park and shuttle areas wherever they wish.

Thinking further, how about forcing the new airport operator to invest on connectivity from surrounding areas. Opening another entry/exit approach or corridors to the airport will be nice, because it would create more options for private parties to build park and ride facilities. How a light/mono rail like thing from Inner Ring Road running around KGA for some distance, and the boundary of HAL airport for most? Provide park and transit complex at the point where this rail would meets IRR, and you take some load off of airport road. Perhaps KGA can offer some land for the purpose. KGA users would sure be happy to pitch in for a re-born airport literally in their backyard :) Anyway, I tried picking out two possibilities for this IRR to Airport link:

Love or hate these thoughts, but I only wanted to seed some re-think around HAL via this post. Bottom-line is, if it opens, it better see some creative investments and upgrades, and we should think long term. No 3 years business please, because we know what would happen three years from now - yet another call to keep it open!

Mind you, now is the time to do some construction around HAL airport - while its shut, we have all the time and space to work on it.

Comments

narayan82's picture

Try Alternative Methods

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I support your idea. Maybe HAL is a good place to start encouraging public transport. Maybe Taxis and Cars should be BANNED from parking inside. Only Vaayu Vajras/Air Lifts/Shared Taxis from HAL airport to any other part of the city? Would that be too Radical a thought? If HAL does re open I really hope it isnt a stark reality showcase of the pathetic state it was in compared to the new Airport. Also I hear that if HAL is re-opened then it will be so only for 3 years. How much money would a firm invest knowing its going to be shut down in 3 years?
Narayan Gopalan
User Interaction Designer
Bangalore
sandeepmr's picture

Satellite Check-in Terminals

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Satellite check-in terminals could be built within 5mile radius of the HAL airport which will prevent choking of the main terminal as well as the approach roads. Lets say if there were 2 terminals built 5 miles apart forming a triangle along with the main terminal, people could use these places to park and check-in and if there were a monorail connectivity between the 3, people can finish security checks in the satellite terminals and direclty enter the gates thru the monorail like many international airports. The monrail will be used to ferry the cargo from the sat terminals too.

Just an ambitious idea.

bialterminal's picture

Re: Satellite Check-in Terminals

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Where is the need then for the HAL airport if there are satellite checkin terminals? Satellite checkin terminals is in the plan for BIA at BRV grounds. Yes, as you said the idea is an ambitious idea and an expensive one at that but doable. While doing it though, the logic should be to plan a rail network for Bangalore city and fit BIA in as an extension. Building an expensive one for BIA and leaving it at that wouldn't be a wise solution considering the big picture.
Devesh's picture

HAL Landside improvements

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We cannot ban cars and taxis from HAL. The main attraction of HAL as an in-city airport would be lost. However, the VV and other mass transport services should be given greater importance and cars parking should be kept a distance away from the terminal.

If HAL opens, and they way MoCA is behaving, it is a BIG "IF", it will primarily cater to regional flights, many of which will be "day-trippers". So we can expect less baggage, passengers wanting quick entry and exit, and also long term parking should be considered.

I have made some initial ideas about landside improvements. Click on it to get the bigger image.

Long term multi-storey parking near the current departures entrance. Convert the existing parking in front of departures to bus and pick-up/drop off lanes. Convert the front of the arrival to a gallery and allow for freer exits. One pick up lane. ABSOLUTELY NO STANDING. Have Tigers running around.

Remove the IOC deport and that will open up the whole area for a multi-storey premium short term car park.

The one area I am not able to resolve is the movement of arrivals cars. That will entail a cross over. Slight traffic jam.

Satellite check-in for BIAL is understandable, not for HAL. No standing line for taxis. If they want to park, they can use the L/T parking or the S/T parking.

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Regards

Devesh R. Agarwal

Visit my aviation blog at http://aviation.deveshagarwal.com

 

-----------------------
Regards
Devesh
Bangalore Aviation
Enjoy life, destroy FUD
silkboard's picture

why not public-transport only?

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Okay, arguable. Cars and taxis dropping passengers off is okay, pick up too is fine. The point is - there should be absolutely no parking allowed at airport. simple reason - space is at a premium. I left the current parking area intact for use by AAI and airline staff, away from the site of main action.

There are no satellite check-in centers. Try take a bus. Otherwise, drop your car at a park and ride complex on airport road (the now empty HAL depot ) or on IRR (near the point for the new connection to the airport), or on ORR (yet another entry point to the airport - don't know how would this be possible). and then take a non-stop shuttle or connecting rail.

The mindset that car's are a must has to go. The revamped HAL airport - let it be the beginning, lets make it the world's first zero-parking airport, something we will all be proud of. Something that the world will copy from us - enough of us copying west's energy and personal-transport heavy concepts :)

narayan82's picture

how much can we invest?

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The real question in m mind is, if HAL is a temporary 3 year option, how much money is worth investing in it? Will multi level parking lots recover the money spent? I doubt Private parties are willing to invest given this short period and if it is AAI investing then would it be priority - as opposed to spending that money on Tier II city Airports....etc? I support the usage of existing infrastructure and public trasnport. Maybe Business Class passengers checkin/park at leela Galeria and then use a High Capcity A/C bus to the airport. Or parking can be facilitated In multilevel parking lots located on 100 ft road (indiranagar) connected with High Capacity Frequent Busses. This way even if HAL shuts down, the growing number of shops in the area will make the parking lot worthwile. Also Private parties will be interested in taking part. Such projects will get people used to the "leave your car behind" policy which can slowly be implemented in other areas such as Bus Stands, railways, Shopping malls...etc
Narayan Gopalan
User Interaction Designer
Bangalore
silkboard's picture

3 year thing is bummer + conditions

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I was thinking of these with pre-condition that the airport will be thought off as a long term option. Short term arrangements are a no no. Because we know that 3 year thing will be an excuse to not-invest a dime. If we are opening HAL, lets do it for long term, and do it in such a splendid world class fashion that GMR, GVK, BIAL etc get tears in their eyes :) Industry driven body have fought so hard to get it to re-open, here is their chance to do more than just opening it.

I would put put two citizen conditions for this airport to run (remember, it impacts residents of the area, and Whitefield commuters the most)

  • comprehensive plan to reduce congestion on airport road
  • check on noise pollution. No flights 10:30 PM - 5:30 AM
  • (a tough one) fast track BRTS like thing which is planned over IRR (Indiranagar to silk board route)
  • (an even tougher one) fast tracking the Metro phase 3 plan that plans to add a line on airport road
When dreaming, dream big. When doing, don't just get it done, do it right.
kbsyed61's picture

Signal Free Junction at Entry/Exit Point !

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Being Friday, I am yet to catch all the tit bits on Praja. But one thing came to mind is that if at all our babus decide to open HAL airport for commercial traffic (may be minority appeasement on HAL Deal), traffic issues has to be sorted out and congestion free solutions has to be in place before the first flight.

 One thing I would strongly advocate is to have Exit/Entry points for the airport to be signal free on airport road. MAGIC BOX could be one solution with ample pedesterian crossings.

 This is a chnace for all of those Pro-HAL campaigners to prove that they care for this city called "Bengaluru" rather than their company bottom lines, travel bills and travel comforts.

 DISCLAIMER - I am not a Pro-HAL campaigner. 

silkboard's picture

Kundalahalli to Kodihalli elevated road

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If you remember Syed, BBMP had announced an elevated road from Kundalahalli Gate to Kodihalli. This would run over Airport Road, and will cover the HAL airport section as well. Perhaps this could be just cut down to magic boxes near HAL airport arrival/exit points. And the elevated road can be converted to a mass transit project.

I never understood where would Metro phase III be, I mean how would it fit it with the elevated road. May be it will eventually be a three level thing - Airport Road (regular business road), then elevated road above it, and the Metro tracks on the very top.

Back to the subject. What I am saying is, let us not take HAL opening (again, leave aside the BIAL-HAL debate - all this is if it opens again) without new investments to spruve up the access and congestion issues around HAL airport. I dont care as much about the Airside improvements, or the terminal building because 1) AAI will anyway take care of airside things, easier to work with them, ask Devesh 2) With international area gone, HAL airport has a lot of space to do a nice and spacious domestic terminal building.

ssheragu's picture

Kundalahalli to Kodihalli elevated road

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an elevatd road over an existing road like HAL airport road will be aesthetically very very negative. in fact the metro on MG road itself is spoilig the aestehtics

a good way would be to identify an under utilised road parallel to airport road (near bellandur lake) and develop that into an elevated corridor with ample space (at least 200 feet to 500 feet) from the edge of the road on either side for the nearest building to be located (in fact it is possible to implemnet this on new roads or under utilised roads)

furrther Metro can be avidided totally on airport road and plannedin some other instead

a three level (three tier) transport system will be out of place in any area in Bangalore

Srinath Heragu

narayan82's picture

elevated bus lanes?

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How about a double lane elevated roads with elevated Bus Bays - and this could act as a BRTS. It would be cheaper then a 4 lane elevated road for all vehicles.
Narayan Gopalan
User Interaction Designer
Bangalore
kbsyed61's picture

Magic or No Magic !

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SB,

W.r.t Magic Boxes and Elevated road, I don't care how we do it as long as the entry/exit points are made signal free to allow the non-airport traffic to move smoothly. That is my bottomline wish. 

 I totally agreee with you on the issue of investment in HAL. Investment should be to improve the access roads, commuter service to airport and all the transporatation & tarffic issues to be resolved. I care less about investment in improvements to terminal and other airport ancilliary infrastructure. That would serve only a hnadfull who would use the airport. We should be wise to use this oppurtunity to invest in traffic related infratstructure that would be beneficial to other bangaloreans as well.

 Actually, if you read all my postings on BIAL, HAL, my interest in BIAL is about the oppurtunity to get the roads and alleys that leads to BIAL gets attention. They get repaired, widen, signals installed, ped crossings are marked and traffic movement is made smooth. My interest is in getting to see these road widenings and improvements leading to growth in commercial activities in its surrounding areas. Increased public transport services on that would help the ordinary Bangaloreans living in close proximity to these roads. I think Praja should take up the initiative to see that all the alternate roads to BIAL and HAL airports are improved and good public transport service is available on these raods. Increased commercial activity would result im BBMP improving the civic amenities in those areas that have been tradionally neglected. I would not hesitate to call this as "intelectual discrimination" that has been going in past 6 decades. Some of these areas are in existance much before the new extensions like PB nagar, Koramangala Mahalaxmi Layout etc. 

 

Devesh's picture

Recouping HAL investment in a short time

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Narayan, as per my sources, the parking contractor is willing to construct a MS car park at their cost, and recoup the investment on their own.

For those who are proposing a "public transport" only option, I beg to differ. Like it or not, India, and Bangalore in particular, has a "personal transport" culture. We attribute it to many reasons, but it is there.

One of the USPs of an "in-city" airport is the short transit time. Taxis will be be a major carrier, and I am sure the VVs will see use, but cars will be used extensively. In fact, due to the regional routes and "day trips" we can expect people to go in their cars, use the remote parking near the main road, do the day trip, return and go home in their car.

-----------------------

Regards

Devesh R. Agarwal

Visit my aviation blog at http://aviation.deveshagarwal.com

 

-----------------------
Regards
Devesh
Bangalore Aviation
Enjoy life, destroy FUD
Devesh's picture

HAL - Need to get a foot in the door

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To start with, we need to get a foot in the door. Then only can we slowly force it open.

On the long term, even AAI, would like to reconstruct the entire domestic departure terminal from scratch as an integrated facility.

-----------------------

Regards

Devesh R. Agarwal

Visit my aviation blog at http://aviation.deveshagarwal.com

 

-----------------------
Regards
Devesh
Bangalore Aviation
Enjoy life, destroy FUD
narayan82's picture

I would rather prefer BIAL

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I'm giong to stick my neck out here. If we are spending 2900 crs on the highspeed railway, and BIAL is expanding to build a sufficiently large terminal (and say this is done by 2011) - would be willing to close HAL down? I don't think so. We will then come up with one more reason to keep HAL open! As disucusses before HAL just seems to be another issue to fight about until death! Its not really aimed at solving a problem. I get the feeling that its more about "interests" that wants HAL open rather than "public opinion." To me none of the arguments are convincing enough. We are solving micro level issues by giving it macro level proirity.
Narayan Gopalan
User Interaction Designer
Bangalore
idontspam's picture

What happened to Choice?

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what happened to the much bandied about 'you must have choice'. Will I have the choice to NOT use HAL and use only BIAL for all my flying needs? Lets see how we do on that one.
silkboard's picture

"personal transport" culture, hmmm

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Devesh, thats the very thing we want to attack - the "personal transport" culture. What better statement to make than an airport itself?

Regardless, I think you may not have read the suggestion in full. tha fact is that land is short supply around HAL. That precious resource should be used for provisioning passenger amenities and public transport options. Besides, by providing public transport driven connectivities from remote park and ride centers, and by allowing car drops and pickup (but no parking), you are keeping almost everyone happy.

So, we dream up a "zero-parking" airport. Central areas (HAL is almost that now) can't afford to dedicate public spaces for parking.

"Foot in the door" approach is arguable on one count. Starting with "3 year only" clause will mean no promise of investments, and the airport will remain as it is - a nightmare for Whitefield commuters and Kodihalli and Murugeshpalya areas in general.

AAI can only be trusted with PTB and related improvements. Connectivity to HAL and congestion around it (which sadly was never discussed to be a problem, ask North and West Bangalore guys now) isn't something AAI can do anything about.

[Not getting into HAL vs BIAL debate here, separate debate]

narayan82's picture

Choice?

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I never really understood the choice issue! Do public get to choose betweeen 3000 cr investments? Today's hindu cleared the 145 kmph High Speed Rail to BIAL. Should be done by 2011 - and its 25 mins from the City CAT.would that satisfy connectivity?
Narayan Gopalan
User Interaction Designer
Bangalore
s_yajaman's picture

Elevated road + elevated train = 3+ year mess

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DMRCL is going to build this elevated line till 2011.  NHAI has plans to build an elevated road from Hebbal to Yelahanka. Till Hebbal we will have the construction of the NS elevated road from Silkboard. 

I am seriously thinking of shifting to the pro-HAL camp :). 

Srivathsa

 

Drive safe.  It is not just the car maker which can recall its product.

Devesh's picture

Narayan, Your opinion .....

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Hi Narayan

You have raised a very valid point. The cost of connectivity to the airport is going to cost us 200% to 300% the cost of the airport. Is this a feasible investment ? What should be the stake of the airport operator in this ? Should there be any PPP at all ? Should the connectivity be completely private ?

{Sorry for the digress here and re-opening a potential can of worms. However, please read this and if you choose not to reply or better PM me your reply I will be grateful}.

AAI technical team did an audit from June 16-18. These guys are the walking talking encyclopedia's of IATA's airport terminal design specifications. I do not mean archtectural, but the hard core specs of the various airport sub-systems.

Now I am sticking my neck out here with a deliberate "hypothetical" and you know what I mean. 

Just "hypothetically" speaking ....... once the report is prepared, and the report says that BIAL is already at a Code D level as per IATA specs instead of the required Code A level for a new airport, i.e. already saturated.

Lets assume the report goes on to say that the airport has only 14.6 sqm of floor space per peak hour passenger (PHP) when compared to 36 sqm/PHP at DEL, 35.21 at HYD, 24.15 at CCU, 23.15 at MAA. Please note, global airports like Changi, HKIA, Manila, Beijing, etc., are all >50sqm per PHP. Some in the upper '60s.

Lets assume the report goes on to say that as per IATA recommendation the terminal area for 10 million passengers (remember BLR did 10.12 mn last year) is 150,000 sq mtr, instead of 71,310 sqm at BIAL. Out of which 18,665 sqm is basement not used for passenger facilities but services and utlities instead, thus further reducing the effective terminal area.

Let us also assume that the IATA recommendation of terminal area is based on 15% retail space, whereas BIAL has already dedicated over 30% of area to retail.

Lets assume the report says that due to improper space allocation, import cargo warehouses are already at capacity.

Lets assume that the report shows that based on security hold, processing capacities of the various sub-systems (check-in, security, etc) is 1200 passengers, but the CURRENT peak demand is already at 1320 or higher. http://farm4.static.flick...

Let us assume that the report calls for IMMEDIATE expansion of BIAL, but we know the expansion will take at least 3 years.

Lets assume this report goes on to recommend that HAL airport be kept open in parallel with BIAL

And let us assume, that a copy of this report is with various Karnataka state government officials, and with BIAL, but is being kept away from the courts because of the the last hypothetical.

.......... then what would be our reaction.

I do not know why we compare BIAL with HAL. HAL terminal represents 10 years ago. BIAL is supposed to represent the future and "world class". Having spent over Rs. 10,000 Cr in resources, in what way are we future-proofing the air transport needs of Bangalore ?

Also, the issue about HAL, is about choice. If you want to fly from BIAL, no one is stopping you. I woud expect you to extend the people wanting to use HAL the same courtesy?

-----------------------

Regards

Devesh R. Agarwal

Visit my aviation blog at http://aviation.deveshagarwal.com

-----------------------
Regards
Devesh
Bangalore Aviation
Enjoy life, destroy FUD
idontspam's picture

LOL @ 3 year mess

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well said... the magic boxes in hebbal may also take till 2011. Visualize the chaos like on hosur road and given the fact there is no alternate road to BIA... I am tempted to join you but I remain comitted to staying away from cesspool that we had been dished out. Why dont they just let the highway be? Interchanges can be built ubobtrusively in 3+ months like the trumpet interchange at BIA one after the other. Either they do nothing or it is overkill

 BTW those magic boxes are falling apart. They relaid the asphalt on BDA junction last weekend and the whole thing is quickly getting bent out of shape. You can see the shape getting distorted by looking at the railings. There are craters developing at the edges consistently and quickly being repaired. Its like somebody is keeping a constant watch and applying first aid to make sure no one notices. The asphalt at cauvery junction turn is also coming undone repeatedly and getting made up. I have no hope for CBI junction. I dont see these fixes lasting very long.

Devesh's picture

Personal transport culture

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Devesh, thats the very thing we want to attack - the "personal transport" culture. What better statement to make than an airport itself?

I agree this is something we have to "attack". However deep rooted cultural changes are going to come slowly. And we need to provide alternates first. Like I said in the WG meeting. We cannot make a statement that "Government needs to discourage private transportation." It has to be "Government needs to encourage public transportation". We are a democracy, and I have freedom of movement.

Ultimately personal transport is not merely choice and convenience, but a status symbol. Otherwise, it would not be such a popular dowry item. :)) :((

-----------------------

Regards

Devesh R. Agarwal

Visit my aviation blog at http://aviation.deveshagarwal.com

 

-----------------------
Regards
Devesh
Bangalore Aviation
Enjoy life, destroy FUD
idontspam's picture

...then what would be our reaction.

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I say we have been taken for a ride... and we need to fix it. Until then I want to have the choice not to step into HAL or anywhere near it. Since we paid thru our noses to have been taken for a ride, I would rather use the underbuilt warehouse till it is fixed 

 I woud expect you to extend the people wanting to use HAL the same courtesy?

It is my pleasure. I dont want to be forced to travel 2 hours and use the cesspool. You can feel free to wallow in it.

 

narayan82's picture

Devesh....

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As I see it if all your assumptions/reports publish that BIAL doesnt not comply to a 3.5 Rating on the IATA scale - then as Mr Brunner Put it - the airport will be handed back to the government. Of course its not going to be much use if they did so as the damage is done. But, I don't think BIAL will let that happen. Right now connectivity is going to cost about 200% cost of the airport. But if BIAL goes ahead and implements its master plan (with the aeropolis...etc), that equation would come down to maybe 20-30% ? Again IMHO its is Stupid (Yes capital S) of the government to build and elevated rail and elevated road. I feel the rail alone (with scope for expansion) will suffice. It will also encourage people not to drive and create a mess on the road. Eitherways, by the looks of things I dont think that Elevated road that NHAI is threating us with is even close to taking off! I am sure sense will prevail before construction to delay the project endlessly!
Narayan Gopalan
User Interaction Designer
Bangalore
narayan82's picture

Srivatsa...

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Well if all goes per plan then the Airport Road (HAL Airport road) will also have its connecting elevated stretch! May as well drive to Mysore to the new airport!
Narayan Gopalan
User Interaction Designer
Bangalore
amaku's picture

My reaction

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..assuming all of 'facts' presented are 100% accurate, I would say let's hold BIAL's feet to the fire to get everyone of these fixed and give up on this 'open HAL' nonsense. Its the only way to make sure all the improvements/upgrades acutally happen. Reopening HAL is a sure fire way of making sure nothing happens. No further investments in connectivity or airport improvements.

Why would BIAL make any further investments? Whether you'd like to admit it or not a significant part of the BIAL investment has ended up in various politician's pockets. Now BIAL is in a situation where HAL is being reopened. Any investment by BIAL will be a purely speculative with no guarantee of passenger and revenue growth anytime in the near future.

Corruption: This is not speculation, I know how much and who, don't ask me how!. This is the root cause for Phase-1 of BIAL being incomplete and also the reason the TATA's pulled out.

--amaku

Devesh's picture

Amaku and Narayan ..... Competition and Corruption

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Amaku has high the nail on the head.

It appears, that the people we have empowered to "hold BIAL's feet to the fire" are either in cahoots with BIAL, or do not weild enough power to influence BIAL. Obviously the message must have gone "if you expose a negative AAI report to the court we will expose our book of accounts to the public".

Right now, BIAL is only 2 months old, and public scrutiny is strong. Within 6 months it will wane. In such a scenario, does it not make sense to break the monopoly and ensure long term competition. All major economies, even GoI, have a some form of anti monopolistic rules. In India it is the competition commission.

Amaku, I will not ask you who, but my information suggests 1000 Cr., direct from Germany to wherever.

-----------------------

Regards

Devesh R. Agarwal

Visit my aviation blog at http://aviation.deveshagarwal.com

-----------------------
Regards
Devesh
Bangalore Aviation
Enjoy life, destroy FUD
murali772's picture

Devesh - Murali bus services

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Devesh

The very first point in the draft policy (of mine) states - 'government to use every means to encourage use of public bus transport services'. The third point of course is 'government to discourage use of all personalized forms of transport, particularly cars' (mind you, not ban). Now, whether you like it or not, these two have to go together, and only then will we have solutions. Admittedly, not many would want to take to the buses, the service (rather the lack of it) being what it is presently. And, that's why we have to have professionalised services.

The future, as far as cities go, is with good professionalised bus services. The earlier the business houses realise this and re-invent their business models to cater to this huge market, rather than continuing to push cars, the better for them, as well as for the cities. Resisting it is like when the bank employee unions of yore tried to resist use of computers, and STD booth operators tried to resist the entry of mobile phones.

I have applied to the government for a license to operate a shuttle service in Koramangala (to begin with). I have worked out the financials based on the current BMTC fares, and even with that, it's a very viable business proposition. And, with necessary incentivisation (as suggested in the draft policy), and with professional handling, it can indeed become a money spinner. What say you use your clout with the government to get me the license, and then we get into a partnership to run the services?

Muralidhar Rao

Muralidhar Rao
narayan82's picture

What competition?

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The only competition that HAL will provide will be "who can get to the airport faster." which does not really concern the airport! An AAI run terminal at HAL and a BIAL terminal - what competition?
Narayan Gopalan
User Interaction Designer
Bangalore
silkboard's picture

PPP and disclosure norms

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Its hard to not do this BIAL HAL thing, isn't it. So I give up my attempt at trying to talk about HAL in isolation.

RTI enthu guys, we need to get BIAL's investment capital details (an account of their investment into construction activities) out to public. Not talking about any investigative and dangerous journalism here, all we want is a report that BIAL would have handed out to AAI. That document must be in public domain.

More than BIAL, the thing here is accountability and openness of PPPs. Pure public enterprise have RTI. Private companies, if listed have compliance norms. PPPs are neither here nor there. A PPP it involves close interaction of Private parties with government, and its PGP (private government) and not PPP (private public) until most aspects of the project are open and available to the public.

I think the norms for PPP must mandate some voluntary disclosures. Forget our state, but can someone tell me, what are the examples of truly successful PPPs in our country?

murali772's picture

Coimbatore bye-pass - perhaps a good model

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The BOT PPP between Coimbatore Municipality and L&T, on 20 Km odd city bye-pass along the National Highway, is one that comes to my mind readily. I don't know enough about it. All I can see is that it seems to work well.

Muralidhar Rao

Muralidhar Rao
silkboard's picture

Now that HAL is likely to re-open ...

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... (thats the word on the 'street'), let us raise the pitch on doing something to imporve "connectivity' to HAL airport itself. Commenting here just to bump this thread up. If some one can start a new thread with HAL connectivity suggestions, that will be great.

Lets not let HAL open (if it opens, via court ruling, 'SMS' pressure from govt, whatever), let us not let that happen without something unique and meaningful on internal connectivity front.

kbsyed61's picture

Would HAL listen?

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 We have heard umpteen times that BIAL doesn't lsiten to Industry leaders which is as good as not listening to the general public.

 Now that the buzz word is that HAL will open.Now the question is would AAI listen to the general public? Would they be transparent in sharing their plans with public? Would theybe willing to consider the various opinions that have been expressed for a world class facilities and amenities? Will AAI would be pro-active to provide all the amenties that their industry friends have complianed about missing in BIAL?

 On top of my list would be, connectivity that would take only 30-45 minutes from every nook and corner of the city.

 If one would to do an honest analysis of this airport tussle, it is not about providing the air facilities for general public, but oppurtunities to get a greater share of gains. Gains depneding upon whom you are talking to. Industry - more business, Politicians - More gratifications, Bureacrats - More power and clout. This is all about my gains - not yours.

 This is my conclusion, unless AAI overnight becomes people friendly and showcase this with a people friendly HAL airport.

silkboard's picture

HAL will, if we tell

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First of all, its not HAL that has to listen. Traffic plan around HAL should be owned by BMLTA. And then we will think of Vajras, parking points (by using HAL's depot area).

AAI may be required to invest in making two level arrival departure structure coupled with a multi level parking building so that they can take pickup and drop traffic with ease. I think given a good architect, HAL airport can be redone to be more efficient than before.

The only hitch is - getting to HAL part is not in AAI's hands alone. And this is something we should put our foot down on. 10-15K people commute over airport stretch to commuter to Bagmane park + Whitefield area + mor. Adding 10-15 mins to those many people everyday is not acceptable, and so is having an airport right in city's backyard that would take only 10-15 mins less than BIAL to reach.

Lets raise the pitch on this. HAL airpot can be a show piece for the new government to demonstrate that it can indeed plan and manage good transportation. Now is the time - HAL is empty - start doing work there right now, before it opens.

[I have not switched sides, still maintain HAL shouldn't be in business, BIAL must be first made to make 100% use of the land it has bee given. But if HAL is going to open, it better ...]

kbsyed61's picture

Forum Topic/Thread has been created

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 A new discussion thread has been created for discussion on connectivity issues for HAL airport.

 http://bangalore.praja.in/discuss/forums/2008/09/connectivity-and-access-first-hal-airport-later

 

 Syed

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