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Retaining HAL airport

Its a last chance to put our weight behind this issue. In view of the urgency of the matter, the Governor should bring the two parties to the agreement — Civil aviation ministry and BIAL — across the table for resolving the issue or, failing which, seek Central intervention to find a way out. The civil aviation ministry itself doesn’t seem to attach much sanctity to its policy of not allowing two international airports within 150 km. Recently it cleared a proposal to establish an airport at Noida near Delhi and Kannur in Kerala. There are number industry leaders voicing concern, but they need a co-ordinated effort & even citizens need to pressurize the government to act on public opinion. Various schemes like giving equity in HAl airport to BIAL & domestic flights during peak hours are being debated privately. So how do we convince the reluctant BIAL to agree on public interest?

After March, it’s mayhem in Bangalore! - MSN India (http://news.in.msn.com/na...)

Bangalore: Imagine traveling for two hours to the airport to catch a 30-minute flight. Or, driving to Chennai in lesser time than getting to the airport and boarding a flight. Well, this could be the grim scenario once the new Bangalore international airport takes over the civilian operations from HAL airport on March 30. Though the HAL airport at Indira Nagar is located only six km from MG Road, the city centre, reaching there is still a motorists’ nightmare, given the burgeoning traffic and poor road infrastructure. What would be the travails of passengers if they have to travel 34 km(from MG Road) to reach the new international airport at Devanahalli, with no rail and poor road connectivity for the first 15 kilometres. The Karnataka Cabinet has approved a high speed rail link to the new airport, but the work on it is expected to start only by December this year. It will take another two years to complete the project. The Government also proposes to start work on a 21.2km, 180kmph expressway from Outer ring road to Devanahalli in September, but the stiff opposition from local people whose land will have to be acquired for the project, may still delay the commencement of the work on the project. It will take one year for the execution of the project. What till then? The growth of city’s air traffic has been unprecedented-- from 4-5 million a year projected in 2001 to the current 10 million. BIAL is expected to start off with 11-12 million.. What a mayhem it will be if the HAL airport is closed before finding a solution to the traffic conundrum? Imagine having to queue up for landing at Bangalore and then thread your way through a traffic jam during peak hour traffic! There is a universal demand, not only from the traveling public but also from aviation industry experts and professionals, that the situation in the IT hub warrants two airports, till the traffic to the new airport is streamlined and connectivity issue is addressed. What stands in the way of retaining the HAL airport after the launch of Devanahalli airport is a contractual agreement entered into between the Civil Aviation Ministry and the Bangalore International Airport Authority (BIAL) according to which no new or existing airport will be permitted to operate as a domestic or international airport within 150 km. Both parties to the agreement stick to their guns and keep the public on tenderhooks. The Ministry is adamant that it cannot breach this agreement and thereby deny a level playing field to other international airports in the country. Albert Brunner, CEO of BIAL, affirmed that any move to retain HAL airport would be a disaster as BIAL’s promoters have invested Rs 2,400 crore and are already working at its next expansion. “Keeping the old airport will also be a legal mess as the dozen concessionaires (of airport-related services like cargo, fuel, ground handling, retail, commercial units) are investing Rs 1,000 crore in their facilities,” he said. He didn’t agree with the suggestion that HAL should operate short flights to neighbouring States, holding that long-haul international flights come to a city only on the basis of short-haul links to places beyond it. But industry experts deny BIAL’s apprehension saying that with the skyrocketing demand for air travel, the Devanahalli airport operators will more than achieve the projected growth in passenger traffic and hence there is no reason for the HAL airport to be considered a competitor. The civil aviation ministry itself doesn’t seem to attach much sanctity to its policy of not allowing two international airports within 150 km. Recently it cleared a proposal to establish an airport at Kannur in Kerala, which is only 93km away from the Kozhikode international airport. Major cities like Delhi and Mumbai have had different airports handling domestic and international passengers. In fact, these airports have two terminals each for handling burgeoning domestic travellers. HAL airport can be retained if the Civil Aviation Minister and BIAL agree to review the agreement. But with both the sides in no mood to relent, only a political initiative could now break the logjam. Before H D Kumaraswamy stepped down as Chief Minister, he had expressed himself in favour of retaining the HAL airport. till road and rail facilities from the city to Devanahalli were in place and had offered to take up the issue with the Union civil Aviation minister. But before he could take any concrete steps in this direction, his ministry fell. A popular government in Karnataka is likely to be installed only by May and since the new airport is to become functional on March 30, any initiative to resolve the issue has to come from Governor Rameshwar Thakur. In view of the urgency of the matter, the Governor can bring the two parties to the agreement—Civil aviation ministry and BIAL—across the table for resolving the issue or, failing which , seek Central intervention to find a way out. But the issue is still to come up for serious consideration by the Governor. With no one else for the people to turn to and with the two contending parties looking the other way, it looks as if BIAL would have its way. This is a story that is likely to develop into something big. So, we are trying to get information from all quarters concerned on how a resolution that would help the air travellers at large can be reached. Watch this space for more… (Source: P. Venugopal, India Syndicate)

christopher's picture

If HAL airport is retained,

If HAL airport is retained, the connectivity to BIAL will be further neglected and will be given less importance. Afterall, its only international travellers, a small percentage of people will be affected. On the other hand, the pressure to retains HAL should be diverted to the connectivity issues plaguing BIAL. After BIAL all has taken so much of time and money to build and its not BIAL's fault.
navshot's picture

Acceptable commute time?

What is the acceptable commute time? I recently read that it should not be more than 1 hour. Now, people are asking to retain HAL airport because it takes longer than that to reach new airport. I wonder where they are currently staying, must be in Indiranagar. Currently it takes more than 1 hr 30 mins (sometimes even 2!) to reach HAL airport from West and North parts of Bangalore. What do they have to say for this?
-- navshot
s_yajaman's picture

Sudden virtues of HAL airport??

Now suddenly the much reviled HAL airport has become much sought after! Navshot is right - it takes 20 mins just to get onto Airport road sometimes and then 20-30 mins to reach Manipal hospital. Let's leave international flights out of the picture for a minute. From a domestic airport point of view,how often does the above-average frequent flyer fly - 4 return trips a month (that is already 100 individual flights a year!)?. He will have to spend an incremental 8*2.5 hrs a month - 16-20 hrs a month on commuting vs. flying out of HAL airport. Is it the end of the world - probably not. He in fact will find smart ways to manage meetings and avoid flying 20% of the time. He will take the train to Madras and Hyderabad (not such a bad deal). The problem is that all the CEOs, etc who are making such a big noise now are all guilty of watching the inaction over the last 3 years. They are partly to blame for not forcing the govt to get its act together. My two cents... Srivathsa

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rnavada's picture

contracdicting ourselves..spirit of democracy

lets try and get the whole process from an outsider perspective( which Albert Brunner tries to put across sometimes in jest and sometimes in anger) 1. Bangalore is the new silicon city, we need a new airport - Year 1995 onwards 2. Vested interests are delaying the airport, we need it fast.--year 2000 onwards. 3. HAL cant handle any more flights..and the road is impossible, why is the government sitting on the papers, clear it fast; damn the clauses( only BIAL will be allowed to operate)--year 2001 4. HAL cannot handle any more flights..cant we speed up the whole process,get it done fast--year 2005. 2007-08: started by "Industry bigwigs" 5. BIAL? that far? where is the conectivity? takes me about 2 hours to get there! nah! give me HAL! inspite of the fact that: 1. HAL cannot handle any more flights. 2. Taxis literally stand on the entrance. 3. Checkin q's routinely go beyond the entrance gate in morning hours( 6:30-9AM) and evening hours. 4. Takes about 1hr 30 mins. for anyone within the city- well; most of them. fact is : 1.Every city has opposed new ports which were faraway from city when started. 2. Having domestic and international flights with 2 hr driving time is non feasible. 3. The " inadequate road" is in fact much higher in width than the current a.port road as-is. 4. We dont commute to airport "daily". unless you work there. Airport should cater to a city and not to certain areas . I live in rajajinagar and i look forward to the new airport .
silkboard's picture

agree with that

Retaining HAL may be bad in long term. Legal tangles, waste of public money (in augmenting and running that airport - AAI runs on our money, plus on BIAL connectivity). In a similar sort of way, I am happy that BIAL expressway didn't happen. See how that has forced all to look for solutions they never though of before - converting ORR to an almost expressway, "instant" flyovers. Short term suffering is good, because only then we will look for fixes. Just watch how BIAL connectivity noise leads to traffic management improvements, especially in North + East Bangalore.
s_yajaman's picture

Nice one - rnavada

You should send in your observations of historical events and statements to the newspapers. HAL airport (and it's surroundings) was probably designed for about 20-25 flights a day. it handles 6 times that today. I have seen the shell shocked look of people when they land in the airport (this can't be true sort of look!). There are 3 conveyor belts, no space around them, no space for people to stand in the taxi queue, no parking space for taxis. I remember the international departure till they moved the check in counters downstairs. It used to be a nightmare throwing heavy bags onto the conveyor belt, running up to pick up bags, hunt for trolleys (all with 2 small kids). The international departure lounge had no space for more than 2 flights at a time - more people standing than sitting. I wonder how they forget all this. The other thing assuming they leave HAL airport open. Which airlines and flights to which cities get to stay there? What principles will be used? Airlines will have to run two operations. How will they make up the costs? Sorry - but HAL airport is "past its sell-by date" (to quote Ravi Shastri) and needs to be retired. Srivathsa

Drive safe.  It is not just the car maker which can recall its product.

sidhanth's picture

Hmm..

All of you have very valid points but I'm not sure I completely agree with them. The first point that some made was about how not having options will force the authorities to come up with ways to solve problems. Unfortunately this is not good for two reasons. The first, the authorities are grossly incompetent at the best of times, under pressure - they are unimaginably bad. The Cauvery junction underpass is a good example of this, its taking way longer than promised (though a month is definitely acceptable if it is helpful), there are schoolboy errors committed like smashing up water pipes and to top it all no one really knows if this whole u-turn business is going to work. Secondly encouraging the culture of only-do-something-when-the-situation-is-so-bad-that-you-cannot-hide-behind-excuses-anymore, is going to be bad for the city in the long-term. Yes planning and execution of anything has always been atrocious, but if the smartest 50% of the bloggers on this site were put in charge, I really think things would change. Accepting a culture of mediocrity is a bad solution, the solution is to kick the idiots out. Of course, who is going to do it, I dont know! With regards to HAL airport itself, I can really see it playing a role in helping Bangalore adjust to its new airport. Yes traffic is bad on airport road right now, but if over half the airport bound traffic was heading towards Devanahalli, the situation would be a lot better. And that goes for the taxis, parking, touts and check-in queues. Keeping the airport open as a limited services airport would be complicated I agree and understand but it would be useful. For a start it could be used as a private airport, where the corporate bigwigs could use private/chartered jets to fly them, which would reduce their whining and complaining for a bit. Secondly it could easily work as a low-cost airline airport. For a start Indian low cost travel is not truly low-cost. Even in developed countries you can take flights for as low as Rs 1200 taxes included. Here even if you get a cheap Rs 500 Deccan ticket, you pay 2 grand in tax. And then on top of that for someone who is traveling low cost, you have to spend a couple of hundred traveling to the new airport, plus paying their disappointing Rs 649 airport usage fee, and you can see how happy the local man will be when he manages to buy a "low-cost Rs499 only*" ticket, where that "*" multiplies his ticket cost several times over. And if BIAL start charging extortionate parking fees to airlines then that will eventually end up being passed on to the consumer. HAL Airport operating as a low-cost airfield could truly lower costs for some who cant easily afford flying out from a world-class airport. In London, a city with 5 airports, Heathrow is the principal non-budget traveller airport. To get to Heathrow from central London you can get the Underground which costs about Rs 350 and takes 1.5 hrs. Or you can get a high speed train link from a central station which costs Rs 1200 and takes 15 mins. Or you can take a taxi, or a bus. There are several options and cover all ranges of budgets. However despite good transport links, due to Heathrow being an expensive world-class airport, no budget airline (Easyjet, Ryanair) fly out from Heathrow. Most fly from London's low-cost regional-travel airport called Stansted, where they can pass on cost-savings to customers. What is the big problem with Bangalore having such a system, whereby low-cost domestic flights can fly out from one airport, and premium, business and international class flights can go from the world-class airport, atleast until issues such affordable transport links, usage fees and the like have been cleared up. HAL airport has been pretty successful financially over the last few years, even if the consumer-end product has been far from world-class. I dont see why BIAL should have a problem sharing a chunk of those revenues, though of course they will be reduced once the new airport starts functioning. It is completely true that most modern cities now have airports which are far outside city-centres, but the obvious difference is that all of these have adequate transport to the airport, and more importantly varied forms of transport which offer varied prices to suit different wallet-sizes. And expecting individuals to reduce their travels to cities nearby is again not a practical route to go down. No IT worker is going to take a train to Madras, Hyderabad, and why should he if the actual travel time is 30-45 mins, vs a minimum of 7 hours to get to Madras by train (and that too if you are lucky with Indian Railways). What he will do is get into a car and drive to BIAL which will create one more traffic unit on the highway to the airport. And with all the other IT guys doing the same, its going to make life harder for all of us. All the traffic that comes from South Bangalore and then heads towards HAL airport will soon be going right through the heart of the city, which is going to make the road congestion even worse. And I think its fair to say there are more airport users in South Bangalore than North, West or East. I live in Yelahanka so technically I shouldnt be complaining, but it takes me a lot of time to reach the current airport. Even once the situation is reversed and North Bangaloreans are close to the new airport, I would not wish the hellish commutes I have to take to the airport on South-Bangaloreans.
silkboard's picture

Lot more than that

Did you know that HAL is currently handling 320-340 flights a day!
namma_nadu's picture

the airport nightmare

As most have reiterated, the airport saga is going to get worse with BIAL. But lets all remember that the road to HAL airport is very bad in terms of traveling so now - people will budget more time to travel to BIAL. In most cases, travellers are paid to travel (ala corporate) so the fees/transportation cost impact is minimal to them --only consideration is time. I think HAL ought to be closed -- considering that we were all fleeced and will continue to be fleeced at BIAL. The main losers are those who are advantaged (realtors et al) thanks to the airport moving away. Considering that i stay in South Bangalore, its gone be hard on us -- but that's a part of life -- we would snigger at those who would travel from Yelahanka to EC -- now they can laugh !!
navshot's picture

Re: Hmm..

You have a point there on low cost options - if HAL can make a profitable business model out of it, that is. But connectivity-wise, nope, I don't think we can use that argument to keep HAL airport open. Not at this 11th hour. All the other points are valid - like having multiple modes of access. Very valid in this case. Hope govt. just does it in this case. One point I personally disagree - in the long run, railways is the way to go for distances less than 400-500km. If you look at some of the European and Japanese examples, you should be convinced.
-- navshot
sidhanth's picture

sure sure, i completely

sure sure, i completely agree about the railways for short distances in the long run..but the unfortunate situation in the country is that the air sector has been opened up widely to private players, and that has increased quality and reduced price (bla bla normal effects of competition)....and that hasnt happened yet with the railways...if quality train services are put in place, then im sure most people other than premium business will (and should!) take the train.. again a good example is the UK, where different sections of railway have been privatised and different companies run them...so they maintain stations, tracks, buy their own trains, and there is an incentive for them to provide faster better quality trains, as they can then complete more journeys and earn more moolah! lets hope it happens here eh!
hmajay's picture

Is it better for the South

Is it better for the South Bangaloreans (from Electronic City) to use the BMIC Peripheral Road to reach Tumkur Road and then to Yelahanka to New Airport or the use roads on eastern side of Bangalore (Outer Ring Road or Varthur Whitefield Road)

Ajay

s_yajaman's picture

Indian Railways is not that bad

I've had the chance/need to take more trains in the last 5 months than in the last 10 years. I've been to both Madras and Hyderabad by train and overall I would give the experience a 7/10. To Madras, the Shatabdis are a very good option and so are the two night trains. Tickets are usually available 3 days before. To Hyd there are almost 4 daily trains. You board at about 7:00/8:00, get a good night's sleep and you reach Hyd by about 6:00/7:00 in the morning. Tickets are available 3 days before and with Tatkal you can get a seat even the same evening. I've yet to see the summer rush - but with some planning I hope to beat it. I book tickets online - so no hassle of going to the station. The AC fares are about 35-50% of flight fares. With the new airports, the taxi fares for a return trip to Hyderabad would be Rs3000-4000 and add about 8 hrs of taxi time. Add waking up at 3:00 a.m. to take a 6:30 a.m. flight and you might wonder if it was all worth it. I guess more people will review such options. Even when my company used to pay for my travel, I used to take the train to Madurai rather than endure the hopping IC flight in the middle of the day. For a one day trip, it would be 3 days worth of travel. I preferred to take the night train, finish work and take the next night train back.

Drive safe.  It is not just the car maker which can recall its product.

sidhanth's picture

Getting from Tumkur Road to

Getting from Tumkur Road to Hebbal means you have to use the ORR, and theres one stretch which goes past rail tracks near Yeshwantpur that is just a 2 lane road (1 on each side) so bear that in mind!
Vasanth's picture

Chikkaballapur Line / Extension of Namma Metro

DMU Train from Bangalore City Station to Devanahalli on the Chikkaballapur track which is underutilized atleast till the high speed rail is constructed. This track if extended upto airport can be used for Cargo Services too. My recommendation is instead of wasting 4,000 crores for highspeed train, extend namma metro upto BIAL airport covering important areas which will be worst affected by traffic after BIAL airport. Run dedicated trains for BIAL with limited stops or dedicate few compartments for BIAL passengers. Travel time may be 45-60 mins compared to 30 mins of highspeed rail.
tsubba's picture

GR Mohan moves court

Advocate moves Court to retain HAL Airport
http://www.hindu.com/2008/02/12/stories/2008021255050600.htm
An advocate from Bangalore on Monday petitioned the Karnataka High Court against the proposed closure of the Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) Airport from March 28/29.

The advocate had also sought a direction from the court to the Civil Aviation Ministry to permit him and scores of other passengers to use HAL Airport for short-haul domestic flights to cities such as Chennai and Hyderabad.

The advocate, G.R. Mohan of Rajajinagar, said once the International Airport at Devanahalli becomes operational on March 28/29, all international and domestic flights would be shifted from HAL to the International Airport.

Quoting reports, Mr. Mohan said the promoters of the new airport, Bangalore International Airport Limited (BIAL), had decided to levy a used development fee (UDF) of Rs. 955 for international passengers.

He said the closure of the HAL Airport would put passengers into hardship as they would have to travel 40 km to reach the new airport. Travel from Bangalore to nearby cities such as Chennai and Hyderabad takes less than one hour. However, the travel time from Bangalore to the new airport would take a minimum of three hours.

He also said that no other international airport was levying UDF and that such a levy would burden the passengers.

Justice Ananda Byrareddy, who heard the petition, said it was more in the nature of public interest and directed it to be posted before an appropriate Division Bench.
blrsri's picture

'striking' differences

"Rajiv Gandhi International Airport, Begumpet, employees on Tuesday ‘confined’ airport director R K Singla to his cabin for over five hours. As a result of the holdup, he missed the all-important trial run at the upcoming greenfield airport in Shamshabad." - TOI news They face a similar issue and they handle it that way..and what we do.. 1. File a case 2. Give long press articles In comparison, there was an announced traffic bandh under Benniganahalli on the OMR, asking for expansion of the bridge. BJP had it on 8th and CPI also had it yest ..there was no effect.. there was a travel advisory for ITPL not to use the Bridge way in the evening but there was nothing unusual happening there..this is what Bangalore is about! :P btw why does Hyd always race with Blr? ministers go saying on the opening day that they want the apt to open atleast a day before the blr one could open..weird.. they better hear the woes of their farmers who commit suicides every year or address the naxal menace!
silkboard's picture

why not ...

... also ask Karnataka HC to prosecute those responsible for the delay in airport connectivity? Any lawyers around on these forums? How much cost and time is it for us to do something like above? Is it possible to do a PIL asking for "accountability"? I would argue that it is in public interest to know which person or decision making body is responsible for connectivity delay.
blrsri's picture

extra service..

building roads and underpasses to airport are part of the extra services provided by the govt authorities..so no accountability for it! :) They didnt even want to put up the trumphet interchange and BIAL had to do it.. So accountability for value added services is not acceptable! :P
yuvaraj65's picture

retaining HAL airport

I have been reading alot of support for retaining HAL airport.The reasons listed varied from connectivity to BIAL, poor infrastruture in the new airport. But one issue is not known to many people is the ATC, at present ATC at HAL is done by HAL controllers who are one of the best in the country. This presntly is one single vast airspace held and controlled by HAL ATC. I read someone telling that HAL handles 320-340 flights a day, but also add to that the flights by Yelahanka Air base, overflying flights which adds to another atleast 60 flights.When BIAL becomes oparational this airspace will be split into 3 portions . HAL, IAF Yelahanka and BIAL. this poses a great hazard with three airfiels operating so close. BIAL is is going to be operated by controllers from AAI, who have no experience in this airspace. With the airspace allotted to BIAL they are going to have a tough time and this will create Air traffic congestion with Air traffic holding for arrival and departures, which is not the case now.The BIAL atc has to co ordinate with Yelahanka ATC as well as HAL ATC for arrivals and dcepartures.All over the world, Whenever a new airport is built the same ATC which were earlier operating the old airport would shift to the new airport, as in the case of Hyderabad. But this is a unique case where a new airport is coming up with new controllers, who are going to find it difficult. AAI keeps telling that they have acute shortage of controllers (they have never had any ATC in Bangalore), I dont understand where did they suddenly find controllers for BIAL? Even if they have posted controllers to BIAL, are these controllers experienced and proficient enough to handle BIAL Air Traffic. Any way if HAL airport is not retained for atleast short haul flights, there are three things I forsee: delays for aircraft f0r arrival and departure into BIAL, Road traffic congestion and probably a reduction in Air Traffic growth in Bangalore.
tsubba's picture

ATC problems

Thanks for this discussion on ATCs. I had read some news paper reports on how BIALATC would have to co-ordinate with IAFATC. Did not understand what co-ordinating means. Was HALATC co-ordinating with IAFATC all these days? Are there protocols to follow when you say co-ordinate? Are these well laid out? Can BIAL pick them up? Why was it that BIAL pick up experienced HALcontrollers? Why did they pick up AAI controllers? Old Hyderabad i guess was an AAI airport. So the experienced controllers were AAI controllers. Who will migrate to HIAL. With controllers in such demand and at such premium why are HAL controllers not 'changing' employers? is controller job expertise highly local? can blr controller get a 'transfer' to kolkatta?
tsubba's picture

Adjourned Till March 4

Road to new airport will be ready by March 15: BIAL http://www.hindu.com/2008... The Union Government and the Bangalore International Airport limited (BIAL) on Wednesday orally submitted to the Karnataka High Court that the trumpet intersection and the road to the new international airport at Devanahalli will be completed by March 15. Additional Solicitor-General Aravind Kumar and advocate for BIAL and former Advocate-General Uday Holla informed the court that the international airport would become fully operational by March 30. A Division Bench comprising Chief Justice Cyriac Joseph and Justice B.V. Nagaranta was dealing with a petition by a Bangalore-based advocate, G.R. Mohan, seeking a direction to the authorities to retain the HAL airport and make use of its for short haul domestic flights. Mr. Mohan said the concessional agreement signed between BIAL and the Government proposed closure of the HAL Airport from March 28/29. He said once the international airport at Devanahalli becomes operational on March 28/29, all international and domestic flights would be shifted to Devanahalli. He said as per the earlier order, he had filed interlocutory applications (IA) on the concessional agreement. Allowing the IA, the Bench sought to know from the parties whether two airports could function simultaneously. When Mr. Mohan said he was not against the international airport and that he wanted the HAL Airport to be put to use as a domestic airport, the Chief Justice sought to know whether two airports could exist simultaneously in the same city. He asked both the BIAL and the Centre to file statements on whether two airports could exist simultaneously and other technical aspects and adjourned further hearing on the case to March 4. Adds ToI Explain HAL airport closure, court tells BIAL, Centre TIMES NEWS NETWORK Uday Holla, former advocate-general, who appeared for BIAL, said the new airport is necessary because the old one is mainly a defence airport with a capacity of handling 2 million passengers. Petitioner G R Mohan contended that the Bangalore International Airport Ltd’s (BIAL) decision not to allow any flights from HAL airport from March 29 and the handing over of HAL airport to the defence authorities will cause hardship and monetary loss to people like him who travel to cities like Chennai, Mumbai and Hyderabad. He claimed the user development fee (UDF) of Rs 675 on domestic passengers and Rs 955 on international passengers departing from Bangalore is a money-making exercise. BIA is situated 40 km from the city and there are no hotels in that area in case domestic flights get delayed due to fog in Delhi and other places. Thus, a passenger will have to shell out more to reach the city. “Let us arrange a ride on March 26-27 to test the condition of roads,’’ Chief Justice Cyriac Joseph remarked in lighter vein when the petitioner said roads are yet to be completed and it takes three hours to reach the new airport.
yuvaraj65's picture

retaining HAL Airport

Mr subba HAL ATC was not coordinating with IAF ATC because HAL ATC was responsible for iaf yelahanka airspace also, a single ATC in this airspace means less coordination for arrival and departures from yalahanka as well as HAL Airport. Regarding AAI picking up HAL controllers, well, thay have a policy for no latreral entry, meaning a HAL controller would have to join at the lowest rung in the cadre, no HAL controller would like to join in the lowest rung, but aspire for a position depending on his years of experience. you are right about hyderabad, the same controllers working at the present airport would be working in the new airport, so, no problems. But, in BIAL there are problems with the ATC.
tsubba's picture

no lateral HAL ATCs

really absurd that BIAL would not take in lateral entry. Any known reason why? doesn't it make sense to take the best people especially in such niche fields? given the promotion system in govt offices, i can understand if it were non-techinical fields but for fields like this based on expertise, the policy seems absurd. so from where is bial hiring people? juniour cadre from aai?
yuvaraj65's picture

retaining HAL airport

Of course not many people in aviation or for that matter  mr.Brunner knows that HAL controllers are the experts in this airspace and the best controllers who can control a mix of military and civil air traffic. You guessed it right! Most of the ATC's at BIAL will be Junior Executive trainess just fresh of the training institute from Civil Aviation training college from allahabad.

BIAL ATC does not hire, but bring in ATC's from small  airports handled by AAI, like Rajamahndry, tirupati, trivandrum, mangalore, coimbatore, Raipur etc, who have probably not handled more than 20 to 30 movements per day, but at HAL they handle 30 per hour during the peak period.

So travellers into BIAL be ready for long journey from house to destination and back.

tsubba's picture

Praful Patel's RS response

The existing airports at Hyderabad and Bangalore will be closed once the new airports are commissioned, Rajya Sabha was informed today. The two projects at Andhra Pradesh and Karnataka are at various stages of completion and steps have been taken by the state governments for providing connectivity at Shamshad (Hyderabad) and Devenhalli (Bangalore), Minister for Civil Aviation Praful Patel said while replying to a query. "Commissioning of the new airports is pursuant to the provisions of the contractual agreements with the concerned airport companies," he said. The existing airports at Hyderabad and Bangalore would be closed for commercial operations once the new airports become operational, the Minister added. source: Deccan Herald Hyderabad, Bangalore airports to close after new ones come up
tsubba's picture

HAL ATC

it is alarming that Brunner does not know about this, especially given we are talking about navigation.

can you tell us how long it will take for people to gain local expertise? what are the tough ones - a sense for the air of bangalore, stuff beyond the daily met charts?

Photoyogi's picture

BDA to BIAL @ 6PM

Almost everyone on this thread seems to be saying HAL airport is closer and for *that* reason it would be a good idea to retain.
So I decided to do a practical test.
At about 6 PM if i were to travel towards the HAL airport it would take me easily 1Hour to reach the turn off at HALairport road and another 30-45 min to get inside!

I wanted to know how long it actually takes for me to reach the BIAL airport around 6 PM
I stay in Kumara Park West somewhere Behind the BDA office.

It was a weekday (monday) 25/2/08
6 PM i started from my home
6:15 i was passing RT Nagar - Sanjay Nagar section
6:30 i was passing IAF Yelahanka
6:45 I was stopped by the security at BIAL airport

So thats a 45 min Drive!
To make the test realisic I choose to drive my Maruti Omni instead of my Indigo, My top speed was 70 Kmph for about 5 min or less, most of the time i intentionally drove at 50 Kmph. Though the roads would allow one to drive twice the speed in a better car

My next question : so once the real BIAL airport traffic starts would it still be as good? umm.. possibly yes... as most of the road is 6 lane and the traffic will be moving faster?
Overall from my side BIAL gets a thumbs up!

--
Praveen
AkA PhotoYogi

-- PhotoYogi

tsubba's picture

photo's yogi?

thanks for the update. a few questions. did you take a tour of the airport? did you talk to anybody about how the traffic is going to be handled around bial - dropoff-pickup, bus, taxi, parking, airport exit? ground traffic. when you loop around at the far end of the terminal and take a right, how is road geometry and layout? how do the two roads merge, how does traffic exiting the far end parking lot merge? any pics? thanks.
Photoyogi's picture

update BDA-BIAL

@tarlesubba
I was carrying my camera but did not click as my intention was to do the timing of the route.
yes, there is way lot of work pending along the whole route i could say the road widening work in sections is still not complete between BDA to hebbal flyover and by my "guestimate" could take another 60 days :(
I was hoping if they would allow me inside the Airport area but i was told by the security that public is not allowed.
As you rightly pointed out the right turn into the airport is a narrow mud road used currently by construction vehicles. I hopefully assume in the wisdom of BIAL it would be a wider road on competion.
Cant comment on the taxis/parking/exit as i was not allowed inside.
I would love to go inside and see. Would anyone know how we can do that (before its thrown open to public)

--
Praveen
AkA PhotoYogi

-- PhotoYogi

tsubba's picture

airport visit

thanks... they are doing dummy trials. and they need volunteers for that. you have act like a passenger. see if you can get in on that list.
Mithun's picture

Retaining HAL airport

I have worked at Electronic city. I do know that it might become extremely tiresome to reach new airport from there. But, I wonder how many people travel to airport directly from their offices? If at all they travel, then how many times? I think most of the people will leave to airport from their homes. The residences are distributed in the city every where. I believe it is lobby from the hospitality & commerical establishments on current airport road. They would loose big amount of business if the HAL airport is closed. Mithun
tsubba's picture

HAL-Effects

hi mithun, but there are those from other cities who are visiting the campuses. on the plus side this could mean instead of one day trips they will have overnight trips, which could be good news for lodging/hotel industry. :):) on the hand for a long time bangalore has been short on budget hotel rooms. remember how during air show people did up-down from chennai? somebody ought to track hotel industry. the new hotels that seem to be coming up are all luxury hotels with very high tarrif. meanwhile... short hop bookings have fallen apparently. ==================================== Short-haul flyers shun new airport TNN via bangalorebuzz Fears are coming true. The new Bengaluru International Airport appears to be putting off travellers flying on short-haul routes — those that have a flight time between 30 minutes and an hour. Reason: the airport is around 40 km from the city and the accessibility is poor. Most are dreading the commute to and from the airport and the expense involved. The rail and road options could be more attractive for many. According to a senior official of a low-cost airline, ticket sales for April and May between Bangalore and Hyderabad, Kochi, Chennai and Coimbatore have dropped between 30% and 35% compared to the same period last year. “Those who are travelling before March 30, when the new airport opens, and plan to come back after March 30, are booking onward flight tickets but are wary about booking their return tickets,” said the official. “Passengers having to fly out of the city from the new airport are thinking twice if their chosen destinations are on the short-haul sectors.” Over 40% of the flights out of Bangalore are to short-haul destinations. Low-cost airlines fill up close to 70% of their capacity through bookings made one to two months in advance, as prices of tickets increase closer to the date of travel. A majority of these advance bookers are visiting-relatives-and-friends segment of passengers who plan their travel well in advance. Observers say airlines may now have to rethink their shorthaul strategy. “If people find train and bus travel to be a smarter option, then airlines will have to discontinue certain short-haul routes or rationalize their frequency on some,” said an industry observer. Full-service airlines say they haven’t seen a dip in sales post-March 30. But a Jet Airways official said sales on short-haul routes could take a beating until passengers get attuned to travelling the long distance to the new airport. At a recent press briefing, Albert Brunner, CEO of Bangalore International Airport Ltd, had said the new airport would witness a 26% increase in domestic flights compared to what HAL airport currently handles. HAL now handles over 300 domestic flights a day. This is on account on the availability of additional slots. But airlines operating across the price spectrum have told TOI that the additional slots will be used to increase traffic on long-haul routes like Bangalore-Mumbai and Bangalore-Delhi, as well as open newer long-haul routes from the city. Short-haul routes are unlikely to increase. No FLYING Start Over 40% of flights out of Bangalore are to short-haul destinations Airlines see a drop in bookings Poor accessibility to new airport reason Airlines may have to rethink strategy
yuvaraj65's picture

wini win situation

okay lots of suggestions on this site, good! some are for the HAL airport some are not. who are not supporting HAL airport point out the same road traffic congestion to the present airport also.Just imagine that out of 12 million passengers expected in 2008, out of which 3 million passengers from HAL and the rest from BIAL, there you are! road traffic problems on both the aiports access solved, no reduction in passengers, as the short haul flights to operate out of HAL and international/long haul flights out of BIAL. This also will ease up the Air Traffic congestion over BIAL. Low cost carriers benefit froom this, so are the passengers and so are the road users. this would be a win win situation for all Bangaloreans and both airports.
sidhanth's picture

exactly what ive been saying

exactly what ive been saying
tsubba's picture

Credibility At Stake

http://www.deccanherald.c... Albert Brunner, CEO of BIAL, while making his point against the retention of the existing HAL airport, said, "Give me one reason, why it should be kept open. There are about three to four reasons on why BIAL can become the transport hub of South India... Should the HAL airport be closed? What are the advantages of retaining a fully functional aerodrome equipped with all infrastructural facilities? Is connectivity the primary drawback of the new Bengaluru International Airport Limited (BIAL) at Devanahalli? To debate these aspects of one airport or more and options for HAL airport, a lively session on what can be easily described as the talk of the town was organised by the Centre for Public Policy, Indian Institute of Management on Monday. Albert Brunner, CEO of BIAL, while making his point against the retention of the existing HAL airport, said, “Give me one reason, why it should be kept open. There are about three to four reasons on why BIAL can become the transport hub of South India. The credibility of India is at stake. How can we convince our shareholders to invest in future expansion of the airport?” Contract “Apart from the reason that BIAL has a contract with the Government of India, where keeping the old airport open is in breach of our agreement/contract, keeping it open will ensure that Chennai or Hyderabad will stand to gain,” Mr Brunner said adding that the much awaited, historic day March 30 not being far off, the count down has begun. Explaining economical reasons in favour of BIAL, Mr Brunner said the project that has seen an investment of Rs 2,500 crore, along with an additional investment of Rs 1,000 crore by various concessionaires, needs to be justified. “BIAL also stated that aviation related reasons were also not convincing to have two airports at present. Once we are saturated in about 10 to 15 years from now, we will need two airports. Until then BIAL has the opportunity to become the air transport hub of the country” he said. Deccan trials on March 7 Speaking to reporters, Mr Brunner said the secretary to the Ministry of Civil Aviation would visit BIAL on March 7. “We will also commence public trials on the same day. Deccan and Kingfisher would take part in the trials. The first jet that was supposed to land in the last week of February, will now take place on the 7th,” Mr Brunner said. Replying to a query he said that the first visit by officials last month was satisfactory. Mr Brunner added that talks were on with the ministry of civil aviation on the issue of the UDF (User Development Fee). “It is possible,” he said referring to a reduction in the UDF for international flights. The BIAL has fixed Rs 955 and Rs 675 as UDF with a fifty per cent discount in the first two months of its operations, along with a PSF (Passenger Service Fee) of Rs 225.
tsubba's picture

HAL official

some issues yuvaraj has been discussing... BIAL may face severe problems soon: HAL official Sunday March 2 2008 08:24 IST Express News Service BANGALORE: Rapidly reaching saturation point and a restricted airspace could pose problems for the new Bangalore international airport expected to begin operations by March end. The only solution would be to upgrade the existing HAL airport with an additional runway, a senior HAL official said on Saturday. Delivering a presentation, 'Airport services - current limitations and trends' organised by the Aeronautical Society of India here on Saturday, S R Iyer, Deputy General Manager (Airport Services), HAL, said the Devanahalli airport could reach a peak passenger traffic load of 40 million per year 'within a few months' as the airport has been allotted about 40 per cent of the Bangalore air space. The remaining 60 per cent is being shared by the Air Force Station, Yelahanka, and HAL airport, where test flights on new or upgraded aircraft would continue to be conducted by the National Flight Test Centre (NFTC). The present HAL airport is handling a passenger traffic volume of eight million per year, and five times that could mean a saturation point that could be difficult to manage, he said. This situation could prevent offering slots to additional airlines as the Indian Air Force was against allowing the new airport to have a second parallel runway due to its proximity to AF Station, Yelahanka. Iyer said the only solution would be to upgrade the present HAL airport by allowing the addition of one parallel runway with rapid exits and taxi tracks to facilitate better coordination for operating the two runways simultaneously. He also called for reviewing the existing Directorate General of Civil Aviation rules and privatising the Air Traffic Control (ATC).
Rakesh KR's picture

Dont kill HAL airport

HAL airport authorities are more than willing to continue commercial operations as per their statements. HAL airport is very close to city and industrial areas thereby convenient to travelling public. Hence, Both HAL and BIAL should be allowed flight operations. Let the airlines choose HAL or BIAL based on passenger preference.

I welcome BIAL and the better infrastructure they offer. Their investments have provided good infrastructure at BIAL. A very good start. Now they should run the operations efficiently and public friendly thereby generating the revenues for BIAL.Just by making investments in BIAL and asking the HAL to close down, what guarantee public will have if the BIAL performance and operations degrade and public start disliking then. Can we bring back HAL airport? No, not at all.. by then most likely HAL airport would have become some big shopping mall similar to KEMPFORT!!. It will be too late by then.

Hence my suggestion is NEVER to close down HAL airport for the benefit of general public. Let BIAL continue with their good work and attract more passengers to its airport by its performance than trying to force and shut down HAL airport and taking the passengers into a monopolistic situation.

BIAL agreement is heavily favouring BIAL in that only BIAL is authorised to run the airport in Bangalore for ever and ever. No other country would ever allow such an agreement to happen in their cities. The question now is which is more important to the government - BIAL's revenue/profit or public interest in retaining HAL airport for their convenience.

Rakesh.

Rakesh.
silkboard's picture

Hot topic

So bumping this to top.

Some more 'ghee' for this fire:

- Whats the definition of "short haul"? Who has the authority to decide that its okay to spend an extra 40 mins going to BIAL to catch a flight to Delhi, but not okay to spend that extra time to catch a Deccan express to Chennai? Just because I am going longer distance, does that make my 40 minutes ''cheaper' ?

- Whats the definition of connectivity "improvement"? Who will determine, and how will it be determined that BIAL connectivity has improved? Hebbal to BIAL in 20 mins? Or Bommanahalli or Padmanabhanagar to BIAL in 30 mins?

- How much time does it take to reach HAL from Yeshwantpur or Yelahanka today?

- Why do people not ask for Electronics City to be shifted to MG Road? BIAL, and oddly enough the connectivity issues around it will make business spread up north, and thus decongest the city - Just the way Electronics City and Whitefield are supposed to be doing it for South and East, and Bidadi/Ramanagarm could do for South-west.

Let us get real folks. CTTP, Metro rail, or BRTS like projects are the ones that can provide consistent and reliable connectivity to BIAL from all points in the city, just an expressway, or a high speed rail from Hebbal will not. Improving connectivity to BIAL is like solving the only real problem Bangalore has today - public transport to get around from Yeshwantpur to HAL, or JP Nagar to Yelahanka, or anywhere to elsewhere.

Bangalore may need a second airport, but that does not have to be HAL. Something little more south, or west, perhaps near BMIC-Mysore expressway is what makes more sense in the long run.

Penalizing and chasing those responsible for the connectivity mess today will ensure that next government does take up connectivity issues in a good and real way. Instead of doing that, we are all spending energy on a short term and 'ill-defined' goal.

navshot's picture

Sad

I'm sad that almost all the people are still stuck with arguing (which we enjoy so much) whether we need HAL airport or not. Irrespective of the decision, we need to get the access problem solved. 

For a change then, here is what I suggest (no new idea though):

Aim for 0 junctions/traffic signals on ring road and NH7, now that we seem to have perfected the art of magic (box). And this in next 3-6 months. If this is done, we can do average speed of 60km/hr, so even from EC, the airport would be an hour or so away.

-- navshot
tsubba's picture

awesome!

that is exactly my point too. what are the metrics for all this? who decides what is short hop and what is not? HAL will go back to being HAL- a place where real solid aeronautics is done. instead of distracting themselves with pretensions of expertise in service industry, HAL should and will concentrate on what it does best - aeronautics. it is things like tie-ups with Boeing that will sustain it in the long run. that is the seed that walchand planted, not a two -bit make believe airport. real problematic symptoms of Bangalore's ailment are transport, as SB said. the rest of it all is smoke. if there is any long shot hope that bangalore's real, fundamental, essential problems will ever be solved it is if bangalore's only airport is at devanahalli, atleast for the next 10-15 years.
tsubba's picture

environmetrics of short haul

chennai is where people are going to and chennai is where the problem is. some perhaps to hyderabad. starting from the flatlands you need to reach the sea level but chennai route is mostly on the deccan plateau. no big shakes, as far as terra forming is concerned - you take tree out here and a field out there, nothing that really matters is going to get ever shaken. hyderabad is even better- point b on the plateau to point h on the plateau. i can understand if this were about flights over the charmadi to mangalore there the alternatives significantly cut into 60% of the India's hottest bio-reserve. or even if it were to points in goa and kerala. but chennai and hyderabad? c'mon have some sense of balance people. to transit these flat surfaces you need to burn so much fuel and create that much pollution? aircrafts look clean, smell nice and feel good, but believe you me, they burn a serious hole. the smelly, smokey train is much cleaner.
sidhanth's picture

hmm but

sb, i generally agree with most of your opinions but not quite sure about this..

 

my opinions on your questions

 

1) the person who does/should have the authority to make those decisions is the end consumer himself/herself...if there are two airports and there is competition, then the end consumer obviously will benefit - if deccan chose to operate their flights from HAL and spicejet is flying to the same destinations from BIAL there is a choice offered to the consumer..the same airline may also offer flights from both airports (as i have no doubt that deccan will do if both are retained)....in such a case those living north of say, High Grounds, may decide that they would rather drive to BIAL than HAL or whatever...regardless of who goes where people have a choice...this also partly addresses your issue of whether your 40 mins is "cheaper" - YOU will be able to decided that, whether you are wiling to drive a longer distance and enjoy better facilities or whether you have a morning at work in EC and need to catch an afternoon flight to mumbai from HAL for an evening conference

 

i would say the only regulation that must be enforced is with regards to international fights..here is where the govt/regulatory bodies must step in and say, from international flights from this city we require a certain minimum standard of operations and service that BIAL offers and HAL doesnt,. and furthermore BIAL must obv recuperate costs...

 

with two airports running (unless airspace problems REALLY hamper this, though I doubt it, many major cities operate 2 or more airports in the airspace blore does) both are encouraged to run a more competitive service...look at BIAL at the moment, they stand to earn the roughly 300 crores revenue that HAL currently earns, and probably more since they will be able to handle more flights than HAL at the moment...STILL they insist on a UDF to "ensure returns on our investment" which I find ridiculous...if their investment is 2500 crore, and they manage to earn 500 crore a year, which they undoubtedly will since they WILL put up aircraft parking charges for airlines, they should manage atleast 500 crore a year and make up their investment in 5 years, which is pretty good...if they ALSO manage their estimated 11 million passengers a year AND charge them all a UDF assuming a 30/70 split between intl and domestic passengers and the UDF rates they have touted they will make an additional 800 crores a year..if there is competition provided then they wont be able to rip people off in such a manner. why do you think Brunner is so against HAL being open - the consortium clearly want to make more money. If he were so concerned about things like airspace conflict and air safety, then maybe he should have worked a little harder on ensuring that the whole ATC situation at BIAL wouldnt turn out into such a mess.

 

2)Connectivity improvement is not an easy topic but most big international cities have at least 2-3 modes of efficient, reliable and regular transport to their airports and varied rates. This ensures that people with different incomes can get to the airport (and this is the key word) RELIABLY. I live in London, and if I want to get to Heathrow I can get the Underground (1.5 hrs, £4), the Heathrow Express (a direct train, 15 mins, £15) or a taxi (45 mins, £40) or even a bus/coach (45 mins, £8). However the key issue here is that I KNOW how long each mode of transport will take more or less -reliability

 

The issue at the moment is that there are only two ways of getting to BIAL, car and BMTC bus. Most business travellers or even premium economy will not take a bus, an unfortunate truth in our country. There are partners at my firm in the UK who earn £1million + a year but will still take a train to the airport. I would say a fair number of people would drive to/from the airport, and unfortunately with only one road it is impossible to say reliably how long it will take. I live in Yelahanka and I KNOW first-hand that this is the case with the road. On a good day I can drive from my house to MG Road in 30 mins at 530pm in the evening, on a bad day it can take 1.5 hours at exactly the same time. There is no knowing how long it will take.

 

Until we can offer more modes of transport catering to diffent wallet sizes AND provide reliability in terms of travel time, we have not achieved adequate connectivity.

 

 

3) As I said times are currently unreliable, but the last time I drove to the airport leaving home at 530pm, I reached MG Road in half an hour and then took another half an hour to get to HAL. Other times it has taken me close to 1.5 hours.

 

As I see it there are two ways of arguing this situation out. One is to say ok we close HAL open BIAL. Yes connectivity is crap at the moment, but it will get better because there is no other choice - it HAS to get better. And then point to things like these magic box underpasses and say "Look the government/authorities have realised they HAVE to do something because there is no other option" and hope that connectivity to BIAL will improve in this "firefighting" method - the situation is so bad that everyone is forced to try and improve it.

 

The second is to say that if there are two airports and there are competitive market forces at work, then each airport has an extra initiative to take a forward role and put pressure on government/sponsor some public works or whatever to ensure that there is better connectivity to BOTH airports. For instance HAL may coordinate with BMRC to build a station at HAL or BIAL could be part of a corporation to build a dedicated train link from the city to BIAL - here both competing entities are forced to take an active role in ensuring better facilities.

 

I agree with the fact that BIAL will make the city spread out more, and this is definitely a good thing, but this will happen regardless of any issue since we know they will at least not be closing down BIAL!!

 

And I completely, wholeheartedly agree with your comment that improving connectivity is the the problem all of Bangalore faces today.

 

Also an airport more south would be great, but BIAL will still whine about their 150km radius rule, which I strongly believe should be scrapped. Also in the long run an airport south is great (Hosur maybe?) but the issue is that there is already infrastructure, a runway, personnel and a lot of experience at the HAL airport. Agreed it is no way meant to handle the traffic it does but there is no reason why it shouldnt still operate.

sidhanth's picture

Im not quite sure that will

Im not quite sure that will work navshot - 60 km/h is a pretty optimistic speed for travel inside a city.

 

our bigger problem is that however much we widen roads, full roadspace is never utilised. there are always vehicles parked/people walking/autos slowing down/ busses stopped badly/construction material dumped, manhole open or some issue or the other on our roads. for example i drive on the hebbal to yelahanka 6-lane road everyday, but there are certain areas, where there are only  1.5 lanes of traffic available,  i dread to imagine what it will be like when BIAL is opened.

 

also magic boxes, are not really going to be a solution to everything. they may make things signal-free, but that does not necessarily ensure increased speed - just look at the cauvery junction - u-turn slows down traffic a lot (though you may spend less time than you would have at the signal).

 

airport being an hour away from EC, Id be willing to offer you considerable odds on that! :-) 

sidhanth's picture

ts, always agree with you

ts, always agree with you ,but not sure it is fair to suggest that HAL has NOT been concentrating on its core business while HAL airport has been open. They may have had to give priority to civilian air traffic in recent years, but its not like they need to operate 50 test flights a day either.

 

can you please explain how you think bangalore problems will all be solved if our airport is at devanahalli - i dont really get this.

sidhanth's picture

APOLOGIES for the lack of

APOLOGIES for the lack of formatting on my post. For some reason Im not able to insert line breaks even with Shift+Enter...
Rakesh KR's picture

Advantages of HAL airport over BIAL

 

 A new railway station can be built near HAL airport by re-installing the abandoned railway line from Bayapanahalli to HAL via BEML. Bayappanahalli is connected to all major parts of Bangalore city by rail and in the main trunk rail route. Thus a good and fast railway connection can be obtained from city to HAL airport with minimum effort. 

HAL airport is within proper Bangalore city limits and well connected to city by the existing airport road. Indiranagar flyover provides short cut to Koramangala and south.

Less than 10km to  MG Road, Raj Bhavan and Karnataka Secreteriat. Similarly nearer to ITPL and electronics city where thosuands of IT professionals work many of whom are air travellers.

HAL police station nearby. No rowdys/goondaism on airport road. No vacant lands either side on roads to city. Safety assured 24 hours on present airport road.

Budget Hotels and restaurants for common man are in plenty nearby to HAL airport -Kempfort stretch.

Plenty of autorickshaws, taxis and bus services available outside HAL airport on the airport road.

No user development fee.

Now Iam not sure how anybody as an air traveller can think of abandoning such an airport for Bangalore?

Rakesh.

Rakesh.
navshot's picture

Today's The Hindu - A lot of myths busted

Today's Hindu has some data on travel times...


Jayanagar to international airport in 64 minutes
http://www.hindu.com/2008...

From ITPL to Devanahalli
http://www.hindu.com/2008...

A very long but NICE route
http://www.hindu.com/2008...

From Electronics City, it was slow going in parts
http://www.hindu.com/2008...

Taking the longer route helped
http://www.hindu.com/2008...

Now with this data, what if we have junction free ring road and NH7?

 

-- navshot
tsubba's picture

awesome posts

150 kms is not a BIAL fancy but a MCA discretion. excellent posts siddanth and rakesh will get back later. meanwhile checkout syed's posts. yeah navshot, perhaps it is worthwhile to track the alternatives. ajay & pratap have been on the western half's case for a while now.
Rakesh KR's picture

HAL airport

 

Tarlesubba, No it is BIAL who insisted and still insisting for the 150km no-airport zone. MCA has already kicked this stupid discretion off into dustbin by sanctioning Noida and Kannur airports recently.

Iam of the opinion that HAL airport should continue with all its flights as it is now, both domestic and international. Once BIAL opens up, leave the decision to airlines on moving to BIAL. Iam pretty sure all existing and newly entering  european airlines will move to BIAL. Many of airlines based in Asia may still prefer HAL airport. Is BIAL ready to take the challenge?

Rakesh.

Rakesh.

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