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Maharajah's 13 acre donation to Bangalore

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I guess the Grand Poobah has consented to giving some of his palace land for greater good so we can now get back to solving the making-cauvery-junction-signal-free riddle from square one. Hope they will build a regular flyover now and close the current magic box for good.

So the chicken neck on Bellary Road is expected to be gone in 3 months. I am confident BBMP's road engineering techniques will ensure we will have the same jams we are having now as it will just be a sea of asphalt with no pedestrian sidewalk and road markings.

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idontspam's picture

Help the new image feature in

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Help the new image feature in the edit box doesnt seem to constrain the images!!!

Srivatsava's picture

Not a Donation!!

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IDS,

Its not a 'donation'. If you read the sidenote, the royal family is getting TDR for the 'lost' property.

Let me turn this to numbers..

Its over 13 acres of land (the article mentions both 13 and 15 acres!!). 13 acres will give you 26 acres of TDR.. thats over 1.1 million sqrt of TDR.. At a very conservative estimate of Rs5000/- per sqrt (thats the going rate in residential areas today), the maharajah and family will get Rs500 cr upon selling the TDR...

If they sell them for 'A' zones like MG road or KG road, that will be a few thousand crores!!

 

Thats only the direct and tacit 'advantage' for the royals... Now, if a govt agency 'recognises' them as present (although disputed) owners of the land, it strengthens their case in the courts!! To achieve that, the royal family wouldnt mind paying 500crs themselves.... but with this 'deal' they get money and they get greater 'recognition' of their claim over the palace land.

How much do you guesstimate the palace land to be worth? easily over a lakh crores!!

-Srivatsava V

idontspam's picture

A little birdie told me this

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A little birdie told me this may have gotten messy if the grand poobah didnt accept the TDR offer.

Srivatsava's picture

BBMP aspect!!

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I cant fathom how this road will be connected to the existing road at the two ends. Will this 100+ft road on the periphery of Palace Grounds be directly connected to the Mekhri circle underpass and what will happen to traffic on the slip road at Mehkri circle ??

The other end is far more scary thought!! Imagine vehicles zooming on a 1.5km long 'expressway' and enter Bellary road near BDA junction (Palace rd junction), go under the old Windson Manor underbridge, and then turn right into Kumarakrupa Road at the roundabout!!! Why cant the BBMP understand that vehicles wont 'yield' even if they put up the signpost in the middle of the road?

 

Let await the DPR... That one will be a lot of 'fun'!!

-Srivatsava V

Public Agenda's picture

21st century demands livability

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Hilarious to call anyone royals or Mjah in the 21st century? maybe we need a feudal decision maker or just God (countring divine lineage) instead? if it is in the vernacular but what a compartmentality? 

OMG!!!  What a swift way to screw up major green lung space of 13-15 acres. No idea of the environmental impact? such a donation of a disputed land.

if at all something needs to be done should it not need any democratic input? 

What about a 21st century model of real place and space making where the public have a major role to decide? Many of the road users like former and  maybe the current heads of the state might like to see a 6-lane expressways with an exclusive lane for their imported SUVs/ MUVs and foreign vehicles?

and the bureaucratic penpushers and the PWD engineers presided over the destruction, who sit in AC comfort and would love to see all roads cut of all trees ( becoz Frisco looks like that) so that their AC cars would be useful? Ac city reduced to only individual ac boxes. Air pollution can be hiked up as long as we think we breathe some other air but unfortunately it is a commons.

What we are destroying is neighbourhoods and livability becoz we cannot allow the chaotic urban fabric to continue and instead desire neat 6 lane roads. some of the worst decisions have been made during the administrator tenure by BBMP. many  could be anti-public !

Are we wedging ourselves into a corner more and more removed from reality?

The public must have a choice and a 6- lane should not be seen as a solution just becoz the engineers or CMs  propose it and former Royals preside over the restructuring of the city?  Calling it a bhoodan is even more hilarious

The PWD leased Golf club land was also handed over to a road earlier so this issue has many dangerous portents?

But the question is are we the "subjects" or the "Sovereign" I guess we need a serious rethink if we want to place ourselves as the former and would love to be ruled over by an 18th century dynasty? 

Do we  reread our constitutional rights since we sorely need it?

The local government needs to prepare a draft annual development plan  for the city, going through all the processes of public consultation (74th CAA)

It does not seem to have ever been done before so what will the future hold if we pursue this? 


Rithesh's picture

Oh so one more road minus the trees

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First it was the golf course road that was shaved, then bellary road stretch opposite to UAS and Veterinary college, then IISc road and now this stretch too. 

Its time we think of a memorial for trees!! should we ask Mr Rajeev to lobby for us to get some land and to cut down some buildings for this memorial.

idontspam's picture

 No idea of the environmental

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 No idea of the environmental impact? 

Lot of muddy open air marriage halls lost, I must say

idontspam's picture

Road widening will be taken

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Road widening will be taken up from BDA junction on Bellary Road to Mekhri Circle on one side. On the other side, it will be from Mekhri Circle to Cantonment Railway Station. The road will be widened to 150 ft which translates into 10 lanes. 

Source

Rithesh's picture

TDRs only if the Wodeyar wins the case

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TOI reports that BBMP will have to give the TDRs only in case the Supreme Court rules in the favor or Wodeyars.

The ownership of the land has been under dispute. Mr Manina Maga Deve Gowda had passed a legislation to acquire this land (definitely one of the most sensible thing he has done) when he was the CM. The case is pending in the Supreme court. 

Also some earlier reports claim that Wodeyar has sold his portion of the land to a city based developer (Dayanand Pai) for 6000 Crores. A part of the money has already been paid to Wodeyar - even before the court's verdict - and remaining will be paid after the verdict. The developer seems to be confident that the court will rule in the favor of Wodeyar. 

srinidhi's picture

10 lanes needed?

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Is there such a desperate need for 10 lanes?

It is probably such dumb ideas which causes more issues for this city than anything..dont we need to concentrate on the junctions? where are the traffic engineering gurus?

They plan HSRL as a grand solution for airport traffic..what will be the effect of that on the road traffic? any traffic studies?

Guess the idea is to create a cash cow for BBMP..where they can take the big road for maintenance frequently and keep sanctioning money for it..and clear bills without any work being done..

psaram42's picture

Where are the “Royals” the erstwhile maharajas?

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There is nothing wrong in Maharaja / common person getting compensation for landed property. It is so because the old type Maharajas do not exists any more in our country. In any case government already has the powers to acquire land for common good after paying a just compensation. Is it not true in this particular case? Why should we crib?

As Naveen says the loss of landed property is the price one has to pay for development. The widening of the road and getting a better fly over at Mekhry circle are in fact essential for public good. It is the development started by SM Krishna’s first GIM and now being followed up by Yeddurappa’s second installment, which has resulted in this prosperity at a cost.

It is only a hype perpetrated by the media and in general praja the people. There are a large number of small or big properties affected already by the current road widening spree, in the city of Bangalore.

idontspam's picture

The magic road

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This is a retro fit solution. This road has already been widened before & after. Its the chicken neck that is being solved now. I am afraid in the hundreds of roads earmarked for widening there are a lot of such chicken necks. The 2 chicken necks causing back up is near the RT nagar turn off where the road narrows into 5 and half lanes and again at Gayathri Vihar gate where it narrows from 10 lanes into 4. Left to themselves BBMP will indeed make 10 full lanes out of even a 40 feet road let alone 150 feet road. I tend to believe this acquisition will be wasted effort if BBMP is in charge.
 
  1. The road from Hebbal flyover till BDA junction is anywhere between 4 lanes to 14 lanes depending on which stretch of the road you are in. 
  2. Even in places where there are 14 lanes there is no walkable sidewalk available. 
  3. Where there are "pedestrian holes in the wall" there is no zebra lines painted so you dont know which one is for pedestrians and which one is for vehicles. 
  4. No proper outlets to drains near sanjaynagar 'magic box' so it is water logged when it rains. Expect delays to the airport this monsoon. 
  5. There is no flow control or definition of how these lanes start or merge or end. Anybody can go anywhere. There are no direction boards on which lanes goes where, because even the BBMP folks dont have a clue. 
  6. Since there are no direction boards people realize they have just passed their turn into the "magic hole" and nonchalantly back up in the middle of traffic instead of going around the next turn. 
  7. The newly painted lanes for the GIM (only on the south bound side of this road) is not of equal proportion and is so temporary you can see it wearing off in a few weeks. They probably thought residents are not worthy of lanes after GIM is over.
  8. Where there is confusion lanes abruptly end and only rangoli border is provided at the ends like margin.
  9. The magic boxes are so magically wavy you will feel you are on a roller coaster ride when you are riding on it.
  10. The bulb turn lanes are one of a kind in the world which ensures vehicles with larger turning radius jam traffic for kilometers behind them. 
  11. The bulb turn lanes also ensure the lanes curve so acutely to follow the edges that the yellow board cabs hurtling down the sanjaynagar magic box screech to a halt dangerously sniffing your cars backside
In short, a comedy of road which BBMP should be ashamed of and if this tragedy was not enough this stretch also has compound walls falling on people.
Naveen's picture

Widening no use

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10 lane road that has only 5 lane & even 4 lane bottle necks !

There is no point widening roads when width can't be maintained uniformly along entire stretches. Further, widening without emphasis on public transport & bus lanes is just an open invitation for those that use public transport on to their private vehicles.

When will we see traffic controlling measures, if ever ?

nl.srinivas's picture

Cannot widen road beteen

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BBMP cannot widen the road between sanjay nagar flyover and mekhri circle since the airforce people have refused to part with any of their land. They refused land even to build a pedestrian over bridge near mekhri circle bus stand. This chicken neck is going to remain for some time I guess.

The bane of bangalore roads are these chicken necks, roads suddenly become two lane or one and a half lane from three lanes and there are criss crossing roads like the one near chalukya which will ensure there will always be vehicle pile up.


rs's picture

Yet another pointless tree cutting exercise.

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The only problem with the stretch between Mekhri circle and BDA junction is the wonderfully designed Magic Box. The only purpose I can see for the acquisition of land is the fixing of the famous U-turn. In fact, from Mekhri to BDA there is no problem, its only the other way. I see no point in widening the road as that will in no way affect traffic - all it will do is make the road more unpleasant to drive on.

This road widening/tree cutting insanity has to be stopped. I really don't know what one can do. Reading the news has become really depressing.

Ramesh

idontspam's picture

In fact, from Mekhri to BDA

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In fact, from Mekhri to BDA there is no problem

How many times a day do you drive on this stretch and at what times of the day?

rs's picture

In fact, from Mekhri to BDA

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In fact, from Mekhri to BDA there is no problem

How many times a day do you drive on this stretch and at what times of the day?

Well, I dont drive this stretch every day, only once in a while - though the stretch from Cauvery to BDA more often. Most of the time I find there is no problem - there is only a problem if there is a wedding or function on in Palace Grounds as people are getting in and out and others have inconsiderately parked on the road. Frankly I dont think its worth sacrificing 50 or so beautiful trees for this. I think what needs to be improved is the famed Cauvery underpass as the ridiculous U-turn causes massive jams.

I think its absurd to expect, given the volume of traffic, that one would have smooth moving traffic all day all the time. The main issue which I find lacking in Bangalore is management. There are several situations which can be greatly improved simply by making one ways/installing traffic lights/analysing the situation which I dont think the police or powers that be do. Their idea of a solution is to apply Band-Aid to the problem point while I believe there is a need for a more holistic approach.

Ramesh

 

 

idontspam's picture

Well, I dont drive this

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Well, I dont drive this stretch every day, only once in a while

I drive it every day and pass through the section many times all times of the day. Believe me its chaos of the nth order along each and every merge point. 

I think its absurd to expect, given the volume of traffic, that one would have smooth moving traffic all day all the time

That applies to all of Bangalore but you cant have 10 lanes going into 4 like at Gayathri vihar within 200 meters. That is down right absurd and not in any engineering book.

murali772's picture

new-age industry!

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but with this 'deal' they get money and they get greater 'recognition' of their claim over the palace land. How much do you guesstimate the palace land to be worth? easily over a lakh crores!!

So, essentially, the solution to the 'magic chicken neck' problem is going to be costing us this much money. Perhaps, this could be categorised as the new-age industry!

 

Muralidhar Rao
rs's picture

I think its absurd to expect,

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I think its absurd to expect, given the volume of traffic, that one would have smooth moving traffic all day all the time

That applies to all of Bangalore but you cant have 10 lanes going into 4 like at Gayathri vihar within 200 meters. That is down right absurd and not in any engineering book.

Hi - my point was widening the stretch between Mekhri Circle and BDA junction - which is what they plan to do by cutting off all the trees is pointless. There are several problematic points between Hebbal Flyover and Mekhri circle, but those wont be solved by widening the road after Mekhri. The  problems between Mekhri and BDA are those caused by weddings/exhibitions/illegal parking along Palace Grounds and by busses not really using the bus bay space provided for them near the BDA overpass - all these are issues of management and enforcement rather than infrastructure. Though of course, enforcement and management doesn't bring in the megabucks...

Of course the ridiculous Cauvery Junction Magic Box needs to be fixed but that's a different story. In any case, there is little they can do after BDA junction - they cannot really widen the Windsor Manor underpass - unless, of course, they decide that Windsor Manor also has to go as a casuality of `development'.

I suppose they also have this absurd idea of running the HSRL along this road as well. The more I think about it the more depressing it gets.

Ramesh

 

 

 

idontspam's picture

 There are several

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 There are several problematic points between Hebbal Flyover and Mekhri circle, but those wont be solved by widening the road after Mekhri. 

Sure, and the biggest problem is at Gayathri vihar which backs up traffic all the way to Sanjaynagar junctions at times. So you need to use the stretch in peak hours to understand the debilitating effect the Gayathri Vihar chicken neck has on the entire stretch.

I cant imagine you believe 5 lanes of traffic converging into 2 in less than 200 meters is not a problem.

On the subject of trees, palace grounds is a virtual dust bowl for acres on the inside. I havent seen a single petition urging the maharajah to convert it into an urban forest. I dont understand this nitpicking at the fringes. Penny wise pound foolish?

Public Agenda's picture

take a Walk inside

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@IDS 

It is not really only about trees Right? just open lands with some grass and shrubs with a few trees , this is exactly as it used to be decades ago. Even this has its own Ecological use  What happens if we can take a walk inside, would not take much to experience the cooling effect and hopefully calming effect of green visually landscapes. About dust the less said the better The constructions of buildings, malls roads and all the rest kicks up moire dust and dirt

But once again whose prerogative is it to prioritise expenditure of 100s of crores of tax payers money without a so much as by your leave and the fact that all these decisions were taken by the bureaucrats / penpushers and armchair 'planners' and now a de facto RW exercise which will be rubber stamped post facto by the elected local government?

talk about skewed logic?   So it is not about the design yet ! we are not even talking about a legit proces leave alone putting a @#$%^*  10 lane road inside the city.

Car users better not dominate a living environment ! 


idontspam's picture

What happens if we can take a

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What happens if we can take a walk inside, would not take much to experience the cooling effect and hopefully calming effect of green visually landscapes

I have, many times and can bet Palace grounds cant hold a candle to the rest of Aramane Nagara ward especially IISC. Try new BEL road on a two wheeler and see how cool it is.

Atleast half of Palace grounds is commercially exploited. 2/3rds is barren. The green cover is hardly 1/3rd. Tell me how many times have the greens made a petition to convert the palace grounds to an urban forest?

 we are not even talking about a legit proces leave alone putting a @#$%^*  10 lane road inside the city

First off I am all for a north-south east-west corridor for the city. It should be 6 lane and where possible it should go underground. If BBMP cant afford it, run it on PPP and charge a toll. I dont understand or appreciate the amaturishness with which this "road laying" done, no pedestrian paths, no crossings for pedestrians, no drains, just asphalt end to end. I believe BBMP cannot touch road projects without involving somebody with proper road planning skills. They should tap into NHAI, they build international quality roads with right features. I am not for 100's of roads being widened calling them corridors without proof of how those corridors help the overall scheme of things. 

We cant afford not solving the Gayathri Vihar chicken neck they have already created. 

idontspam's picture

But once again whose

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But once again whose prerogative is it to prioritise expenditure of 100s of crores of tax payers money 

I definitely do not expect somebody not living in this area or not using this road on a daily basis to understand how a perfectly good plan has gone to seed because of mindless asphalt, magic boxes and chicken necks. Even the trees could have coexisted if planned properly its still not too late to re-balance the ratios. 

srinidhi's picture

BDA to let ppl 'FLY' - again

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A massive 7.5-km long elevated flyover connecting Balabrooie Guest House (high Grounds)and the Hebbal flyover is in the pipeline.

http://www.deccanherald.com/content/75076/flying-over-ground-realities.html

The mantra is 'BBMP has a problem..lets flyyyy over it!'

Bangalore will soon become a case study on the worst unplanned super rich city in the world..

idontspam's picture

Planners must be awarded

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“Are the BBMP engineers good for nothing and lack expertise,” questioned Nagaraju

And he is proposing this flyover to answer this question? Below statement might give him an indication what people think.

M N Sreehari sarcastically commented that the city planners ought to be given a Nobel Prize for coming out with such concepts

And to think that a few people on this forum believe an elected BBMP was their saviour over ABIDe. God Bless.

Public Agenda's picture

Lets come to terms with who is the

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Lets come to terms with who is the SOVEREIGN not the ruled mental slaves!

Can we ? penpushers and bureaucrats have put the Mayor upto it 

what does rubber stamp mean ? esp if the ruling party demands conformity at the top in an engineering hegemony

the whole point is to compare to two more exits the YPUR Nelamangla and before that the silkboard-E city (10 km)! right?

The IInd proposed by the Grand Poobah of the IT industry in mid- 2004 and the Ist by the NHAI/ PWD in 2007. SO if new copycats come around and other speak throu elected reps what  scathing criticism do we hear  for the people who tied up over 1000crs in 14 kms of concrete? 

and BTW  it was the same ex MS Ramaiah traffic safety expert who proposed a flyover onto Magadi Road past sunkadakatte in 2007- 2008? which was never even looked at ? talk about sour grapes? and let us not forget that this entire bunch of Signal free roads, flyovers, transit oriented development etc came out of Abide's informal chats with stakeholders so all the major money making projects are all in this neat bundle of 22,000 crs !

This is happening while most of the santioned JNNURM projects are failing becoz of lack funds ? talk about insurgent politics and urban planning!


idontspam's picture

 SO if new copycats come

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 SO if new copycats come around and other speak throu elected reps 

Speaks volumes about the ingenuity and intelligence of the copy cats. And also of the people who believe stupid dreams of elected representatives is more tolerable than acceding to solutions which are already in place and creating some difference. No wonder the looters arent the industry poobahs but the elected ones who spin castles in the air in the name of giving people a hearing.

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